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[ripe-chair-discuss] ripe-chair-selection-10.md & ripe-nomcom-10.md

Daniel Karrenberg

2019-05-11 13:19:02 CET

RIPE NCC staff member

Jim,

Thank you for your support!

On 12/05/2019 14:53, Jim Reid wrote:
> Minor nit:
> 
> "the RIPE WG Chairs Collective promptly selects a person to act as RIPE Chair Ad Interim and initiates this selection procedure" is ambiguous/unclear. I think this should be "... RIPE Chair Ad Interim who initiates..."

"... the RIPE WG Chairs Collective promptly initiates this selection
procedure and  selects a person to act as RIPE Chair Ad Interim ..."

Is this clear/less ambiguous?

> ...
> Adopting a suitably tweaked IETF's Nomcom process seems a bit excessive but I can live with it because that process is mature and has been well debugged/scrutinised => there's no need to reinvent the wheel. And compared to the alternatives of trying to build something comparable from scratch that could get consensus...

That's where we are coming from.

Daniel

Daniel Karrenberg

2019-05-11 14:08:14 CET

RIPE NCC staff member

Dear colleagues,

Attached are two documents which we submit for discussion on the RIPE
Chair selection process. One of the documents, marked "ripe-xxx", is
perhaps quite different in length from what RIPE has been practicing
until now. We'd like to explain how we landed on this as the proposal.

Following the discussion at RIPE 77, the authors sought to come up with
a "BCP10-like" procedure for RIPE. The more we looked at the text of
BCP10 itself, and tried to come up with our own adjustments, the more it
became clear that it is like program code: most of the time, the
procedure follows a short path through the code; it's the error handling
that adds to the length. That "error handling" text has been arrived at
over time and much review in the IETF.

So rather than remove chunks of it, with the risk of omitting something
that the community would then have to reinvent, we decided to reuse
BCP10 almost in its entirety. If the community decides, on reflection,
that certain sections aren't needed after all, then they can of course
be removed.

We have highlighted the original text from BCP10 in *markdown emphasis*.
This is a RIPE proposal and so all text is open to discussion, but when
reviewing the document, this will advise you whether you are commenting
on new text or text originally from BCP10.

So:

- ripe-yyy states the role to be selected, and that a nominating
  committee will be used to select for it.

- ripe-xxx describes how to compose and operate that nominating
  committee.

ripe-yyy is a close adaption of the text we have been discussing here up
to now. The most significant change is the reference to the recall
procedure of ripe-xxx.

The documents are written in markdown. For those you prefer other
formats we provide PDF and HTML here:

https://web.karrenberg.net/ripe-chair-discuss/ripe-chair-selection-10.html
https://web.karrenberg.net/ripe-chair-discuss/ripe-nomcom-10.html

https://web.karrenberg.net/ripe-chair-discuss/ripe-chair-selection-10.pdf
https://web.karrenberg.net/ripe-chair-discuss/ripe-nomcom-10.pdf

We look forward to your comments on this list, and the discussion at
RIPE 78. As usual we encourage you to propose alternative text when
suggesting improvements.

For the authors

Daniel
User Image

Randy Bush

2019-05-12 10:45:27 CET

impressive.  i am sure we can find nits; but, imiho, it is close enough
to try it.  thanks to the folk who put this together.

randy 

Jim Reid

2019-05-12 14:53:09 CET

Minor nit:

"the RIPE WG Chairs Collective promptly selects a person to act as RIPE Chair Ad Interim and initiates this selection procedure" is ambiguous/unclear. I think this should be "... RIPE Chair Ad Interim who initiates..."


Adopting a suitably tweaked IETF's Nomcom process seems a bit excessive but I can live with it because that process is mature and has been well debugged/scrutinised => there's no need to reinvent the wheel. And compared to the alternatives of trying to build something comparable from scratch that could get consensus...

I support these draft documents and thank Anna, Daniel, Hans Petter and Mirjam for preparing them.


Jim Reid

2019-05-13 04:43:32 CET

> On 11 May 2019, at 12:19, Daniel Karrenberg <dfk _at_ ripe _dot_ net> wrote:
> 
> On 12/05/2019 14:53, Jim Reid wrote:
>> Minor nit:
>> 
>> "the RIPE WG Chairs Collective promptly selects a person to act as RIPE Chair Ad Interim and initiates this selection procedure" is ambiguous/unclear. I think this should be "... RIPE Chair Ad Interim who initiates..."
> 
> "... the RIPE WG Chairs Collective promptly initiates this selection
> procedure and  selects a person to act as RIPE Chair Ad Interim ..."
> 
> Is this clear/less ambiguous?

Yes, thanks. I don't care who has this responsibility if/when these circumstances arise - just that it's clear who that is and there's just one of them. :-)


User Image

Brian Nisbet

2019-05-13 15:56:17 CET

Daniel,

Thanks to you and all of the co-authors for your ongoing work on this.

I think it's definitely in a more than good enough shape to throw it at reality and see what happens.

One minor but important mark-up issue that confused me for a moment:

The section on Chair Selection is mixed up under Chair Duties because the words Chair Selection aren't marked up as a 3rd level heading. The text is absolutely fine, but for readability a bold heading would be greatly preferred. Also the removal of the vestigial 4.5.

Thanks again,

Brian

Brian Nisbet 
Service Operations Manager
HEAnet CLG, Ireland's National Education and Research Network
1st Floor, 5 George's Dock, IFSC, Dublin D01 X8N7, Ireland
+35316609040 brian.nisbet _at_ heanet _dot_ ie www.heanet.ie
Registered in Ireland, No. 275301. CRA No. 20036270

> -----Original Message-----
> From: ripe-chair-discuss <ripe-chair-discuss-bounces _at_ ripe _dot_ net> On Behalf Of
> Daniel Karrenberg
> Sent: Saturday 11 May 2019 13:08
> To: Discussions about the RIPE Chair Selection Process  discuss _at_ ripe _dot_ net>
> Subject: [ripe-chair-discuss] ripe-chair-selection-10.md & ripe-nomcom-
> 10.md
> 
> Dear colleagues,
> 
> Attached are two documents which we submit for discussion on the RIPE
> Chair selection process. One of the documents, marked "ripe-xxx", is
> perhaps quite different in length from what RIPE has been practicing until
> now. We'd like to explain how we landed on this as the proposal.
> 
> Following the discussion at RIPE 77, the authors sought to come up with a
> "BCP10-like" procedure for RIPE. The more we looked at the text of
> BCP10 itself, and tried to come up with our own adjustments, the more it
> became clear that it is like program code: most of the time, the procedure
> follows a short path through the code; it's the error handling that adds to the
> length. That "error handling" text has been arrived at over time and much
> review in the IETF.
> 
> So rather than remove chunks of it, with the risk of omitting something that
> the community would then have to reinvent, we decided to reuse
> BCP10 almost in its entirety. If the community decides, on reflection, that
> certain sections aren't needed after all, then they can of course be removed.
> 
> We have highlighted the original text from BCP10 in *markdown emphasis*.
> This is a RIPE proposal and so all text is open to discussion, but when
> reviewing the document, this will advise you whether you are commenting
> on new text or text originally from BCP10.
> 
> So:
> 
> - ripe-yyy states the role to be selected, and that a nominating
>   committee will be used to select for it.
> 
> - ripe-xxx describes how to compose and operate that nominating
>   committee.
> 
> ripe-yyy is a close adaption of the text we have been discussing here up to
> now. The most significant change is the reference to the recall procedure of
> ripe-xxx.
> 
> The documents are written in markdown. For those you prefer other formats
> we provide PDF and HTML here:
> 
> https://web.karrenberg.net/ripe-chair-discuss/ripe-chair-selection-10.html
> https://web.karrenberg.net/ripe-chair-discuss/ripe-nomcom-10.html
> 
> https://web.karrenberg.net/ripe-chair-discuss/ripe-chair-selection-10.pdf
> https://web.karrenberg.net/ripe-chair-discuss/ripe-nomcom-10.pdf
> 
> We look forward to your comments on this list, and the discussion at RIPE 78.
> As usual we encourage you to propose alternative text when suggesting
> improvements.
> 
> For the authors
> 
> Daniel

Daniel Karrenberg

2019-05-14 06:35:05 CET

RIPE NCC staff member

Brian,

thank you for your support.

On 13/05/2019 15:56, Brian Nisbet wrote:
> ... The section on Chair Selection is mixed up under Chair Duties because the words Chair Selection aren't marked up as a 3rd level heading. The text is absolutely fine, but for readability a bold heading would be greatly preferred. Also the removal of the vestigial 4.5. ...

Corrected.

This was the third time I started from a clean version of BCP10. Didn't
see the headings for all the paragraphs. ;-)

Daniel

User Image

Brian Nisbet

2019-05-14 09:55:36 CET

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Daniel Karrenberg <dfk _at_ ripe _dot_ net>
> Sent: Tuesday 14 May 2019 05:35
> To: Brian Nisbet <brian.nisbet _at_ heanet _dot_ ie>; Discussions about the RIPE Chair
> Selection Process <ripe-chair-discuss _at_ ripe _dot_ net>
> Subject: Re: [ripe-chair-discuss] ripe-chair-selection-10.md & ripe-nomcom-
> 10.md
> 
> 
> Brian,
> 
> thank you for your support.
> 
> On 13/05/2019 15:56, Brian Nisbet wrote:
> > ... The section on Chair Selection is mixed up under Chair Duties because
> the words Chair Selection aren't marked up as a 3rd level heading. The text is
> absolutely fine, but for readability a bold heading would be greatly preferred.
> Also the removal of the vestigial 4.5. ...
> 
> Corrected.
> 
> This was the third time I started from a clean version of BCP10. Didn't see the
> headings for all the paragraphs. ;-)

Given the size of the document, it's a wonderfully clean job, thank you!

Brian

Brian Nisbet 
Service Operations Manager
HEAnet CLG, Ireland's National Education and Research Network
1st Floor, 5 George's Dock, IFSC, Dublin D01 X8N7, Ireland
+35316609040 brian.nisbet _at_ heanet _dot_ ie www.heanet.ie
Registered in Ireland, No. 275301. CRA No. 20036270