[members-discuss] [ncc-announce] [GM] Consultation on RIPE NCC Charging Scheme 2024

Hello!

*) In general:

It appears to me, that a large portion of membership fees goes towards 
expenses that are not part of the core task(s)/mission.
...So instead of a "we want/need more" - there should be an 
evaluation/review of what spendings the ripencc can reduce - and how to 
optimise for the "core mission".

*) Membership fee model:

If our aim is create a fair membership model, then we should take a 
couple of factores into consideration such as services used.

Lets consider a basic LIR that just mostly uses the DB (plus LIR Portal) 
to manage its resources.

...Why is there a need for them to also finance "events" ouside of the 
yearly conference? - Any "Training Programs" or "Community Building 
Events",... - Should be billed to those attending.
A small LIR with will send a lot fewer Humans to Trainings/Events 
compared to a bigger (in terms of Humans, not resources) LIR.

Similarly, a LIR holding or sponsoring more resources should contribute 
more twoards the total budget when it comes to operating expenses.
In a fair model, this would be a linear cost for resources alloacted to 
the LIR directly (ie: per /24 for ipv4 or per /29 for ipv6).

Then there are the "Staff Intensive" Things - Such as: Resource 
Sponsoring/Transfer Tickets. Those have an initial "workload" for the 
staff evalutating the request.
However i do not really see any big "followup" cost. So may i propose a 
"verification/evlauation fee" (ie 50 or 80 or 100) fee for those.
With a "lowered" yearly fee for resource sponsorings in order to 
compensate for the extra work that they make during a LIR audit (ie 15 
or 25 per resource per year).

*) Numbers we are missing:

Can the NCC Staff plese provide the numbers for how how many LIR's are a 
total aggreated allocation of (ipv4):
- only a /24
- a /23
- a /22
- .......
- a /16

This should help us get a clearer picture what the billing/fees could 
look like.


Kind Regards

Sebastian Graf





On 3/7/23 10:35, Simon Jan Haytink wrote:
> Dear RIPE NCC members,
>
> We would like to re-open the consultation we began with the membership in 2021 on the RIPE NCC Charging Scheme model, and we would like to carry out that consultation well in advance of the RIPE NCC General Meeting (GM) May 2023.
>
> In 2021, we presented on this topic at the GM, and we also surveyed our members and held an open house to get direct input on the charging scheme model that members would like to see implemented by the RIPE NCC. The outcome at that stage of the consultation was that there were strong cases made for both the current one-LIR, one-fee model and for a category-based model that would charge based on the number of resources held by a member. A strong case was also made to charge for all resources allocated or assigned by the RIPE NCC, including ASNs, and to charge a fee for transfers.
>
> The Executive Board decided to suspend the consultation in light of the war in Ukraine, but we are eager to decide on a way forward on this matter together with the membership.
>
> One of the main reasons that we would like to advance the discussion on the charging model is that we expect many members with multiple LIR accounts who received resources in 2021 to merge these accounts in the coming year. This means that the income the RIPE NCC receives will be reduced by a significant amount and we will need to ensure that our charging model allows us to collect the revenue required to maintain our operations. We believe that a category-based model would be best suited to cover this consolidation risk. Continuing with the existing model would mean that an increase in fees for all members would be required. Our ultimate goal is to arrive at a charging scheme model that will be sustainable for many years to come, meeting the needs of the RIPE NCC’s members.
>
> To help with discussion and to provide something tangible for members to assess, we are putting forward two draft models for members to review. These models can be summarised as:
>
> Model 1: A “one-LIR, one-fee” model based on the current RIPE NCC Charging Scheme 2023  that also charges for independent resources, ASNs, transfers and changes in business structure such as Mergers & Acquisitions.
>
> Model 2: A category-based model that charges per member (not per LIR account) and is based on resources registered and that also charges for independent resources, ASNs, transfers and changes in business structure such as Mergers & Acquisitions.
>
> In order to allow members to form an opinion based on their own situation, we are providing an Excel sheet that will allow you to calculate the fees you would pay under each of the draft models. It is important to be aware that at this stage, the numbers assigned for each item are indicative and would be reviewed in light of the discussion with members. We plan to review these figures following consultation with the members, and giving input on those figures would greatly help to arrive at a good model.
>
> You can download the Excel sheet from:
> https://www.ripe.net/participate/mail/member-and-community-consultations/member-calculator-charging-scheme-2024.xlsx
>
> We also plan to hold another Open House meeting on the Charging Scheme in March to further discuss the charging scheme models. The Executive Board will then take the input and decide on one or more charging schemes for the membership to vote on at the GM to be held on 24 May 2023. The outcome of that vote will determine the charging scheme model to be used in the coming years.
>
> I ask that you provide your input on this important consultation on the Membership Discussion mailing list (members-discuss at ripe.net) by 26 April. Input provided up to this date will be considered by the Board when formulating the charging schemes to be proposed for the GM. Input after this date is of course also welcome although it might not be reflected in the schemes put forward to the membership at the GM.
>
> The consultation will also be recorded and available from:
> https://www.ripe.net/participate/mail/member-and-community-consultations
>
> I look forward to your input.
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Simon Jan Haytink
> Finance Director
> RIPE NCC
>
> Summary
>
> 7 March: Start consultation with membership on RIPE NCC Charging Scheme model
> 21 March: Open House to discuss charging scheme with membership
> 24 March: Executive Board meeting to discuss input received so far
> 12 April: Publication of Draft RIPE NCC Charging Schemes 2024
> 26 April: Publication of Final RIPE NCC Charging Schemes to be voted on by members
> 24 May: RIPE NCC General Meeting May 2023
>
> References
>
> Open House and Survey Results
> https://www.ripe.net/participate/meetings/open-house/ripe-ncc-open-house-charging-scheme-principles
>
> Presentation at General Meeting
> https://www.ripe.net/participate/meetings/gm/meetings/may-2021/documentation-and-archive/ripe-ncc-charging-scheme-discussion.pdf
>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: OpenPGP_0xCB3F9792B5ACD96C.asc
Type: application/pgp-keys
Size: 3935 bytes
Desc: OpenPGP public key
URL: <https://lists.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/members-discuss/attachments/20230309/043b052e/attachment.bin>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: OpenPGP_signature
Type: application/pgp-signature
Size: 840 bytes
Desc: OpenPGP digital signature
URL: <https://lists.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/members-discuss/attachments/20230309/043b052e/attachment.sig>