[ncc-services-wg] Re: [members-discuss] New Charging Scheme

Hello Simon,
Hello Erik,
Dear List,

 >>     - linear: An IP address should have a price. An LIR with a /12 
allocation
 >>     uses 256 times the resources of an LIR with a /20. This should be
 >>     reflected in the fee.
 > No, they don't. See above.

Of course, they do ;-) IPv4 address space is a scarce and valuable 
resource now. And a /12 user occupies a lot more that limited resource 
than a /20 user does.

If someone justifies a /12, Internet is obviously a major part of his 
business (or he's incredibly huge). And more importantly, he uses a 
major part of the limited resource. A "fee" of EUR 0.002 per IP is more 
than reasonable.

 > How about the annual fee, calculated at the end of each calendar year 
is comprised of:
 >
 >    - A base RIPE "membership" fee
 >    - A "maintenance" fee for each allocation to the LIR (e.g. EUR 50 per
 >      allocation, like the PI blocks)
 >    - A "allocation" fee for each allocation made in the previous 12 
months.

I strongly feel that there should be a fee on IP address consumption 
(e.g. the EUR 0.002/IP Address). I tried to avoid the "per usage" fee as 
it will make billing more complicated. I personally would not care about 
EUR 50 per allocation request.

 > But what about the other objects ?

ASN: I would give away ASN for free. We have rules in place that define, 
when an ASN is justified. The supply of ASN is unlimited for all 
pratical means. Don't forget": In my proposal, every resource owner will 
pay at least EUR 500, so this should be covered. Besides, an ASN is not 
very useful on its own without associated address space. We could follow 
ARIN: Pay EUR 500 per ASN (and USD 100 per year once per organization).

PI space: Just treat it as usual, either have a sponsoring entity, where 
is just counts as regular IP address space, or become an extra small LIR 
on your own.

IPv6: Have no clear opinion on this. For now, I would give it away for 
free now and let's discuss the matter, when IPv6 traffic approaches 25% 
of IPv4 traffic.

 >>     - Major players pay EUR 5500 at most, which will be less than 
"peanuts"
 >>     for them.
 > Not necessarily. Okay, most LIRs are also ISPs, but not all. You 
can't assume
 > that for an LIR that a bigger allocation means a bigger revenue stream.

Let's assume "less than /16" (2012: "large" category) for "major 
player". So you can justify more than 65k addresses, you have at least 
65k services instances allocated to these addresses, which will need 
some kind of hardware. The EUR 0.002 will NEVER be an important part of 
your budget.

We are a government funded, small "ISP" that's confined to the 
schoolyard. We're providing services for the schools in our district. 
The budget of our associated schools exceed EUR 40M/y easily. So don't 
tell me, that EUR 5k will be a problem for anyone who can honestly 
justify more than a /16.

Just as a reminder, the comparison the RIPE2012 proposal and the ARIN fees:

          wiwi           RIPE2012        ARIN

/23   EUR 502    EUR   250   USD  1250

/22   EUR 502    EUR   750   USD  1250

/21   EUR 904    EUR  1750   USD  1250

/20   EUR 1308   EUR  1750   USD  2250

/19   EUR 1716   EUR  2500   USD  2250

/18   EUR 2132   EUR  2500   USD  4500

/17   EUR 2565   EUR  2500   USD  4500

/16   EUR 3031   EUR  2500   USD  4500

/15   EUR 3562   EUR  5000   USD  9000

/14   EUR 4224   EUR  5000   USD  9000

/13   EUR 5148   EUR  5000   USD 14000

/12   EUR 6597   EUR  5000   USD 14000

/11   EUR 9094   EUR  7500   USD 14000

/10   EUR 13688  EUR  7500   USD 14000

/9    EUR 22477  EUR  7500   USD 14000

/8    EUR 39654  EUR  15000  USD 14000


Calculation is simple: EUR 500 + ((log2(#IPv4)-10)*EUR 400+(EUR 
0.002*#IPv4). My assumptions were: EUR 15M with 7100 members results in 
EUR 2100 need per member and per year in average, so a /18+ will pay 
more than the average share. Having members with less than EUR 500 fee 
is not useful, commercially.

...a and get me right, please: RIPE does a great job, no doubt. I do NOT 
want to deplete RIPE of money.

Greetings from rainy Switzerland

     wiwi

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