[members-discuss] Legal compliance doubts

I don’t see how a member organisation can run a vote (or poll) that excludes members from voting based on their location or nationality. While I understand “why” the suggestion was made I can’t see how that would work legally.



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From: members-discuss <members-discuss-bounces at ripe.net> on behalf of Serg Galat <greysticky at gmail.com>
Date: Wednesday, 23 March 2022 at 16:30
To: Piotr Karwowski <piotr at karwos.hk>
Cc: Cynthia Revström via members-discuss <members-discuss at ripe.net>
Subject: Re: [members-discuss] Legal compliance doubts
[EXTERNAL EMAIL] Please use caution when opening attachments from unrecognised sources.

Dear Piotr,

RIPE as a community can solve this by voting on two positions:

1. Should RIPE NCC allow russian LIRs to postpone their payments?
2. Should RIPE NCC allow ukrainian LIRs to postpone their payments?

Ukrainian and russian LIRs shall not vote in this poll.
Let the community to decide.

On Tue, Mar 22, 2022 at 12:43 PM Piotr Karwowski <piotr at karwos.hk> wrote:
>
> Do not forget that eventually voting might be disrupted.
> I do not know exact numbers of RIPE members per country, but I think Russia might have quite high numbers of them.
> Then we can have situation just like in United Nations, when Russia can simply make a veto.
>
> And now we clearly see - UN Was established after WW2 to not repeat history and attentuate all eventual conflicts  at its first stages.
>
> Veto way make UN completly useless organization now.
>
> Any way to check how many members we have in RIPE per country ,
>
> Pobierz aplikację BlueMail dla systemu Android
> W dniu 21 mar 2022, o 12:51, użytkownik Stary Bezpiek <stary.bezpiecznik at gmail.com> napisał:
>>
>> W dniu 19.03.2022 o 06:59, Taras Heichenko pisze:
>>
>>>  Peace.
>>>
>>>  I am glad to see that RIPE NCC is legally clean. There are questions about humanism but of course this is not a cope of work of RIPE NCC.
>>
>>
>> In my opinion - it is not.
>> RIPE NCC claims to operate in accordance with its own policies, that are
>> created by the community.
>>
>> Meanwhile, we have a selective treatment of Members in terms of payments
>> without:
>> a) RIPE NCC resolutions
>> b) without annexes to contracts with users.
>> c) policy change
>> Neither the Agreement nor the existing policies allow for discretionary
>> behavior like "this user may not pay, and others must" without formal
>> authorization.
>>
>> Of course Ukraine as an attacked country can and must be treated with
>> any aid, including exemption from payments, when possible. But it has to
>> be passed by a resolution of the RIPE NCC ordinance. The resolution may
>> contain one sentence: "We do not issue invoices to Ukrainian members
>> until the end of the war." Vote: who is in favor? All? The End.
>>
>> On the other end is Russia, as a country that has been subject to
>> sanctions. It should not be of our interest, that they cannot pay. In
>> result, recognizing that Russia users may not pay, because they have
>> "banking difficulties" means, that no one from Russia will pay. Without
>> any consequences. Although they probably can pay. Letting go at this
>> point is very unfair to other Members.
>>
>> I also have a difficult in payment because the Euro exchange rate is
>> very high. Does it interest someone?
>>
>> --
>> Stary Bezpiecznik
>>
>>
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Sergey

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