[members-discuss] Complaints against LIRs ignored by NCC

  

Hi All, 

Why not use IPv6. The IPv4 market will go down
definitively. 

Hugs, 
---

Joao Silveira 

On Mon, 16 Dec 2013 11:34:29
-0000, Tony Turner wrote: 

> Hi All, 
> 
> A Fee for a Resource that is
significantly smaller than Demand won't work .... all it will do is
create another market for those with extra IP's ... 
> 
> What do other
markets do when there is a shortage ..... it is not guaranteed to work
in this market .... 
> 
> Never posted on here but here is my 2 pence
worth so bear with me ... 
> 
> Our experience from a telecommunications
view is interesting. We had been issued by Ofcom 600 x 10,000 blocks of
phone numbers, some ranges were issued in 1K blocks where there was
shortage in a town, but if not 10,000 blocks, our mobile range is
100,000 
> 
> Now we never need 10K blocks for all towns, yes London but
not Maldon .... 1K would have been fine. 
> 
> Now Ofcom have never
charged for phone numbers historically, but that has all started to
change due to a shortage 
> 
> and of course lack of Government funding.

> 
> First they went to 1K blocks as numbers for a town became
scarce.... 
> 
> Now they are starting to charge for numbers in the
towns which they say are a conservation area where numbers are scarce.

> 
> They charge 10p per number per year, whether allocated to a
customer or not. 
> 
> Now we have given back promptly 4 million phone
numbers some big mobile companies have also dumped the numbers and
services on some of those numbers like broadband VOIP some mobile
operators cut the service. 
> 
> Phone numbers I am sure will never run
out so companies not using them will give them back as they know, "hey
we can get some more". 
> 
> With IP's that's different, I think
whatever happens IPV4 will run out (or has) whatever approach is taken.
The big boys know this and can afford to keep them whatever is charged
for them so I doubt the big telcos/ISP's will ever give them back.
Irrespective of a charge. 
> 
> The only IP's you may get back if they
are charged for is from small operators ... but as IP's are so scarce I
even doubt these will be given back as companies can rent them out as
they are a scarce resource with a demand greater than supply unlike UK
phone numbers where the demand is less than supply but phone numbers
where just allocated on blocks too large (so mis -managed). 
> 
> You
may think great they will rent them out, I doubt the terms of such will
make you smile ... 
> 
> So charging won't necessarily work. 
> 
>
Regards
> 
> Tony 
> 
> FROM: members-discuss-bounces at ripe.net
[mailto:members-discuss-bounces at ripe.net] ON BEHALF OF Oliver Bryssau
>
SENT: 16 December 2013 09:59
> TO: RIPE
> CC: members-discuss at ripe.net
>
SUBJECT: Re: [members-discuss] Complaints against LIRs ignored by NCC 
>

> Hi All, 
> 
> I think that post hits the nail on the head perfectly.

> 
> I guess if so many of us feel this way we should investigate the
Ripe framework to see if there is something that can be done to create
positive change. 
> 
> This would be a great short/medium term solution
however we all must look to support ipv6 natively. 
> 
> Merry
Christmas,
> Oliver 
> 
> On 16 Dec 2013 09:39, "RIPE" wrote: 
> 
>
Hello,
> 
> everyone who says "IPv4 is gone" is living in his/her
dreams, denying reality and IPv4 market (and those mentioned average 2
letters/IPv4 requests per day). It may be true for some, but it
obviously isn't for others, no matter reasons. While I understand IPv6
propagation, I don't think that punishing/discriminating small IPv4
holders in need for a few more IPs is right. Actually, releasing those
big unused IPv4 blocks might have much better impact for IPv6
development, while the small ones would appreciate "a few more C" and it
may even be enought for a few more months/years this way.
> 
> While I
must admit I'm not sure how to do this, some fee for IP addresses sounds
like natural way. So I must agree, if you are happy IPv6 user who had no
problems to move from IPv4 (or started at IPv6 directly) and doesn't
need IPv4 addresses anymore, just return them all and you can stop to
care about it and less lucky us. You may even have it cheaper. Saying
that you don't need IPv4 because you have IPv6 already sounds like "I
don't have this problem so I don't want/need it to be solved and I don't
care about others" to me. Or in worse case, it may even be "I like
current state because I own those big blocks and I have profit from it".
Nothing personal here, I wasn't screening anyone and I don't accuse
anyone. Just annoyed from all those "IPv6 solves everything" announcers
who are, at same time, so much against returning of any unused IPv4
space. Thanks for your understanding.
> 
> Merry Christmas to everyone
>

> Matej Vavrousek
> CentroNet, a.s.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
>
From: members-discuss-bounces at ripe.net [2]
[mailto:members-discuss-bounces at ripe.net [3]] On Behalf Of Andrea
Cocito
> Sent: Thursday, December 12, 2013 5:42 PM
> To: Gert Doering
>
Cc: members-discuss at ripe.net [4]
> Subject: Re: [members-discuss]
Complaints against LIRs ignored by NCC
> 
> On Dec 12, 2013, at 5:39 PM,
Gert Doering wrote:
>> IPv4 is *gone*, get over it. No matter of
discussion here or elsewhere
>> will bring back IPv4 in quantities
needed to "last forever", so all you
>> are doing is postponing the
inevitable, and burning lots of effort and
>> money in the denial
phase.
> 
> Right, then if the fee scheme is changed in that way there
will be no problem for LIRs who have millions of IPv4 addresses
allocated to release them and save money :)
> 
> A.
> 
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Links:
------
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