Local IR mtg, draft minutes

Please see the following draft minutes of the meeting last
Wednesday.  Anne Lord mailed them to me on Friday, just
after the end of RIPE 22 - is this a record?  Whatever,
well done and many thanks, Anne.

I'd be glad to hear comments, corrections etc.

Cheers.

Mike Norris



			Local IR Working Group
			  Minutes - RIPE 22
                     Wednesday 11th October, 1995


At this working group meeting there were 43 attenders. 

1. Preliminaries

Anne Lord (auto) volunteered to take the minutes.  The agenda was 
agreed as previously drafted to the working group mailing list. No
additions to the agenda were made.

2. RIPE 21

As the draft minutes of the working group meeting from RIPE 21 had been 
circulated and no objections were raised, they were formally approved.

3. Reports from Registries

3.1 European Regional Registry (NCC)

Staff Developments:
Since the last RIPE meeting, the RIPE NCC has appointed three new junior
hostmasters:

	- Nick Reid (full time) from UK
	- Hatice Kuey  (full time) from Turkey
	- Els Willems (part time) from The Netherlands

Additionally a further two more part-time junior hostmasters will start on 
16th October:

	- John Crane from UK
	- Soodabey Eshkey from Iran.

It is estimated that by the end of the year with these additional resources
that local IR's will no longer experience hostmaster delays.     

Request Tracking System: 
This is currently being implemented at the RIPE NCC. The tracking system
has been described in RIPE document ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/docs/ripe-183.txt.
All new requests are issued a ticket number, which should be used in future
related correspondence. Absolutely crucial to any dealings with the RIPE 
NCC hostmasters is your registry ID.  

The RIPE NCC now deals with around 300 local IR's, an increase of around 
60 since the last RIPE meeting.


3.2 Last Resort Registries

There are currently around 30 Last Resort Registries.  In the context of
previous discussions around Provider Independant and Provider Allocated 
address space (ripe-127) it has been agreed that Last Resort Registries
should be phased out.

At the NCC contributors meeting it was decided that the last resort IR's 
should be charged like any other registry.  This has had the desired impact 
of accelerating the number of Last Resort IR's wanting to close.  Billing 
for 1996 will be issued in November.   A question was raised as to how 
many last resort registries expect to continue operation after November and
the answer was that out of the 7 present, only 1 expected to continue.

A question was also raised regarding what to do with the remaining address
space held by the last resort registry if they wished to close. The answer
was to contact <hostmaster at ripe.net> to discuss the procedures. 

There was another question, regarding what to do with large companies who
are requesting PI address space.  They can contact the RIPE NCC to discuss
becoming an enterprise registry.  They can also receive PI address space
but this will carry with it no guarantees of routability in the Global
Internet.   Local IR's can hold PI address space, but this will be 
allocated by the RIPE NCC probably from the remaining 192.x.x.x address space.
 
3.3 Other Registries

There were no reports from other registries.

3.4 Global Coordination

There has been minimal progress on rfc1466++ due to lack of time from
all parties involved. The revision of ripe-104++ had been dependent on this rfc
being updated. It was proposed to finish updating ripe-104++ irrespective of
the development of the rfc as the RIPE document is urgently required as a
guideline document for the many new IR's coming on board.  There were
no objections to this proposal.

Action:  Mike Norris and RIPE NCC 
To find volunteers from the Local IR working group to continue working on 
the revision of ripe-104++ without waiting for the publication of 
rfc1466++. 

4. RIPE NCC Services

4.1 Charging model for 1996.
At the RIPE NCC contributors committee meeting in September a charging
scheme for 1996 was agreed (This scheme was circulated in the minutes
of that meeting).  The billing scheme is described at ftp://ftp.ripe.net/
/new-registry/billing-96.txt.  Bills will be issued in November, unless
you contact <billing at ripe.net> to say that you would like to be billed in 
January 1996.  So far, there have been no cancellations for RIPE NCC
services from any registries. 

It was also decided that the "time-permitting" service would be 
discontinued from 16th October.  The RIPE NCC hostmaster service is 
offered to contributing registries only. 

4.2 Billing procedures
In summary, there are 4 categories and each registry decides which 
category they would like to be in. The category information per registry
is public information but the RIPE NCC commented that in the future they
may be more active in suggesting, movement between categories to established
local IR's. 

4.3 Charging by local IR's 
There was an outstanding action on Mike Norris to prepare a paper
on charging by local IRs.  He would complete this asap.

4.4 Tracking and ticketing system (ripe-183)
Already discussed above.

4.5 Training

There have been 4 courses held.  There are approximately 15 attenders
per course, and this is the maximum number of attenders sought per course.
There are two further courses planned for November, one in the UK and one
in Norway.  The dates are not yet fixed but there will be an announcement
to the local IR mailing list.

Note should be made that the training courses are only open to local
contributing local IR's.  If any local IR is interested to host a course,
then the RIPE NCC would be happy to deliver a course in your country.
Please contact <training at ripe.net> to dicuss the details further. 

The slides from the training courses in Amsterdam and Munich are available
in the RIPE document store in ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/local-ir/training/*

5. Address Assignment

5.1 Procedures (ripe-104)

As discussed above the need for ripe-104++ documentation is now so great
that it was suggested to form a group of volunteers from the local IR
working group to actually progress this document asap.   Ideally, this  
document should be ready before the next RIPE meeting in January.  It 
was suggested to have the volunteers to come to the RIPE NCC for a day to 
meet to progress this work.  The RIPE NCC offered to pay for travel and 
subsistence for those interested.

5.2 PI vs PA address space (ripe-127 upcoming rfc)

Ripe-127 is on track to become an rfc.  Daniel Karrenberg was informed
by the rfc editor that the publication of this document is on track. It
was generally recommended to include in documentation to your customers
a clarification over the PI and PA recommendations in ripe-127. 

5.3 Reverse domains 

The procedure for delegating revers domains has now been automated. 
Requests can be sent to <auto-inaddr at ripe.net>.  David Kessens gave
a short presentation of this. In summary:

use 'inetnum' object with one nameserver per 'rev-svr' attribute
or for block (/16) delegations, with one nameserver per 'nserver' 
attribute

Using the wrong attributes in the objects will not break the auto-delegation
procedure.

The software for this tool is available in ftp://ftp.ripe.net/tools/
inaddrtool-950815.tar.gz.

Note that the RIPE NCC only makes delegations for 194.x.x.x. and 193.x.x.x
blocks of address space.

There was a question regarding delegations for > er than /24 prefixes. 
This is possible and there is a description of how to do this in the document 
store in:  

ftp://ftp.ripe.net/internet-drafts/draft-degroot-classless-inaddr-00.txt.  

5.4 Status and use of rfc1597

The revision to rfc1597 is currently being discussed within the IETF
CIDR-D working group.  The revision will be reissued as a BCP - "Best 
Current Practices" rfc series. 

It was again recommended to point not only large organisations with
firewalls at this document, but also VSE 's < 50 hosts not wanting to 
connect to the internet. 

It is hoped that this document will be out by the December IETF. The
actual content of rfc1597 will be changed considerably.   It is noted
that the address space reserved and used for private address space still
stand.

6. Tools

There were no other reported tools other than that circulated previously
by Nigel Titley.  The tool checks the status of the registrations in the
RIPE database against another file in which records of registrations are
held. 

The source code is available from :

ftp://ftp.bt.net/networking/tools/tree/tree-2.1.1.tar.Z

7. Input from other working groups

7.1 Database

There was a request for clarification of the difference between the 
<auto-assign at ripe.net> mail address and the <auto-dbm at ripe.net>. It
was noted that the <auto-assign> address contained some additional
sanity checking for new objects, so that existing objects could not
be clobbered. Further discussion over this was deferred to the 
database working group.

Additionally, there was a question over whether route objects, with
no matching inetnum objects should be allowed or checked for.  It  
was deferred to the database working group for potential discussion.  

7.2 EOF

The EOF working group highlighted a need for a survey of domain procedures
amongst different top level domains.  This topic was taken up in the DNS
working group. 

8. AOB

There were no items discussed.  The chair thanked the audience for 
their input.