From daniel.karrenberg at ripe.net Wed Dec 5 11:27:13 2012 From: daniel.karrenberg at ripe.net (Daniel Karrenberg) Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2012 11:27:13 +0100 Subject: [ipv6-wg] [routing-wg] MERIT Darknet Experiment and RPKI alerts In-Reply-To: <20121123092830.04848105@shane-desktop> References: <8380CB55-4728-4866-AC91-7FF3EC5444BC@ripe.net> <509CE360.8010109@CC.UniVie.ac.at> <8BB6437E-6273-4733-BCAE-DD3F652B38C8@ripe.net> <20121113115912.4634ab63@shane-desktop> <20121123092830.04848105@shane-desktop> Message-ID: <783A463C-2797-4124-9FC8-304027601B62@ripe.net> On 23.11.2012, at 9:28 , Shane Kerr wrote: > 1. This link was not posted *in advance*. The reason I proposed in > advance is partially so that we could get review and feedback such as > Wilfried's, and prevent future issues. That is true and an oversight on my part for which I take responsibility. There are many reasons why this particular experiment got started too quickly and why it included address space that was not "dark". We can discuss them over a beverage or at the next working group meeting if anyone wishes to make a point of this particular oversight. I will not waste mailing list bandwidth unless there is a strong call to discus these reasons here. > 2. It was not sent to any of the RIPE mailing lists until after > problems were reported. RIPE Labs is cool, but AFAIK the RIPE > community still lives & breathes in the RIPE working group mailing > lists. That was also an oversight and not intentional. Usually we indeed announce these articles on the relevant working group mailing lists. It has not happened this time, but it is certainly an exception. > > 3. There is apparently neither a procedure nor a policy concerning notification of experiments. Does there need to be a *policy* on everything? Look: we made a mistake with this one. It did not have any real consequences. Yet we corrected it very very quickly and without hesitation once the mistake was apparent. Don't you trust the RIPE NCC anymore to do the right thing without a policy? Do we need to invoke the policy cannon for everything until our community does nothing else but make policies and the RIPE NCC does nothing else but make sure to make no mistakes running afoul of all these policies? I think we should be very conscious about when we invoke the policy process. In areas like address space distribution and registration formal policies are vital. However, invoking the policy process whenever anyone has an issue with what the NCC does or did is not the right thing to do. Daniel From maildanrl at gmail.com Sat Dec 8 23:43:19 2012 From: maildanrl at gmail.com (Dan Luedtke) Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2012 23:43:19 +0100 Subject: [ipv6-wg] [routing-wg] MERIT Darknet Experiment and RPKI alerts In-Reply-To: <783A463C-2797-4124-9FC8-304027601B62@ripe.net> References: <8380CB55-4728-4866-AC91-7FF3EC5444BC@ripe.net> <509CE360.8010109@CC.UniVie.ac.at> <8BB6437E-6273-4733-BCAE-DD3F652B38C8@ripe.net> <20121113115912.4634ab63@shane-desktop> <20121123092830.04848105@shane-desktop> <783A463C-2797-4124-9FC8-304027601B62@ripe.net> Message-ID: On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 11:27 AM, Daniel Karrenberg wrote: > I think we should be very conscious about when we invoke the policy process. In areas like address space distribution and registration formal policies are vital. However, invoking the policy process whenever anyone has an issue with what the NCC does or did is not the right thing to do. Policies are bureaucracy and should be created *only* if there is no other way. Although this particular experiment might have not helped pushing signed routes and also caused a lot of confusing for some operators, I generally like the idea of the NCC support experiments. Only in an environment where NCC staff does not need to go through hundreds of policies and regulations right before every single step, worthy experiments bringing up worthy results can take place. To sum it all up: Please do *not* make a policy just because NCC staff acts open minded. Regards Dan (who dislikes bureaucracy in general) -- Dan Luedtke http://www.danrl.de From gert at space.net Mon Dec 10 10:26:10 2012 From: gert at space.net (Gert Doering) Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2012 10:26:10 +0100 Subject: [ipv6-wg] [routing-wg] MERIT Darknet Experiment and RPKI alerts In-Reply-To: References: <8380CB55-4728-4866-AC91-7FF3EC5444BC@ripe.net> <509CE360.8010109@CC.UniVie.ac.at> <8BB6437E-6273-4733-BCAE-DD3F652B38C8@ripe.net> <20121113115912.4634ab63@shane-desktop> <20121123092830.04848105@shane-desktop> <783A463C-2797-4124-9FC8-304027601B62@ripe.net> Message-ID: <20121210092610.GY88969@Space.Net> Hi, On Sat, Dec 08, 2012 at 11:43:19PM +0100, Dan Luedtke wrote: > To sum it all up: Please do *not* make a policy just because NCC staff > acts open minded. Nobody was suggesting to do a policy because of an *open* mind set - the problem was more with "not enough brains involved" here. (I don't have a specific problem with this experiment, partly because it's not using my address space - but I second the notion that this should have been clearly communicated to the community beforehand, and maybe someone should have told Merit that they are supposed to announce unallocated address space, not "all of it", if that was the underlying agreement... but I don't think this needs to be discussed any further, as Daniel has already agreed to improve in-advance communication for next time) Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen HRB: 136055 (AG Muenchen) Tel: +49 (89) 32356-444 USt-IdNr.: DE813185279 From marcoh at marcoh.net Sat Dec 15 13:55:45 2012 From: marcoh at marcoh.net (Marco Hogewoning) Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2012 13:55:45 +0100 Subject: [ipv6-wg] (Not a) call for content for RIPE 66 Message-ID: <14C02605-B632-4643-99F3-ADF9B9D80B16@marcoh.net> Dear colleagues, Preparations already started for RIPE 66. Please take a moment of your time and help in this process by telling us which topics, technologies or speakers would you like to see in Dublin. Our working group is chartered to take on "anything useful in helping people to deploy IPv6, and to manage IPv4/IPv6 co-existence", why not write it in with that one question you would really like to get answered. As part of our two 90 minute slots, we are thinking of dedicating a portion to a measurements theme track. The questions we would like to ask there is where measurements become useful to your IPv6 deployment, or to rephrase, which measurements would you like to see? Help us shape the agenda by providing your feedback. Reply to the list and you may find yourself amongst likeminded people. Of course if you have this wonderful IPv6 project or idea you would like to share, we are always open for suggestions. Please submit a short description of your talk to IPv6-wg-chairs [at] ripe [dot] net. Merry christmas and hope to see you all in Dublin, On behalf of IPv6 Working Group Chairs, Marco Hogewoning From marcoh at marcoh.net Thu Dec 20 14:21:05 2012 From: marcoh at marcoh.net (MarcoH) Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2012 14:21:05 +0100 Subject: [ipv6-wg] Draft agenda RIPE 66 version 1 Message-ID: <29D05BB1-774C-4C84-A11F-48B0D1ABEFC1@marcoh.net> We still have a long way to go until we meet in May in Dublin, but we have the first draft of the agenda online :) https://ripe66.ripe.net/programme/meeting-plan/ipv6-wg/ > Draft IPv6 Working Group Agenda - Version 1 > > Session 1 ? Wednesday, 15 May 13:00 ? 15:30 (Main Room) > A) Welcome and Administrative Business > > B) ?Progress in DHCPv6? > Internet Software Consortium ? Speaker TBC > > C) ?Implementing Full IPv6 Support: More than Binding to an AF_INET6 Socket? > Bert Hubert, PowerDNS/Netherlabs > > > Session 2 ? Thursday, 16 May 09:00 ? 10:30 (Side Room) > A) IPv6 Measurements Panel > Organisers: > - Marco Hogewoning, RIPE NCC > - Meredith Whittaker, Google/M-Lab > > X) Close As you can see, we still have plenty of room for more talks.If you have a topic that you think is interesting or relevant, please drop us note. Merry Christmas, The IPv6 Working Group chairs, Marco, David and Shane From training at ripe.net Fri Dec 21 15:40:41 2012 From: training at ripe.net (Training Mailbox) Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2012 15:40:41 +0100 Subject: [ipv6-wg] RIPE NCC Webinars - new dates In-Reply-To: <50A9F074.4000905@ripe.net> References: <50A9F074.4000905@ripe.net> Message-ID: <50D474E9.9040306@ripe.net> [Apologies for duplicate e-mails] Dear colleagues, We are pleased to announce the launch of new dates for our Webinars for LIRs. The RIPE NCC Webinars are live, one hour online training courses that allow participants to interact with our trainers without leaving their desks. We focus on the topics and issues most important for LIRs. Register now at https://www.ripe.net/lir-services/training/e-learning/webinars Participation is limited to 20 people, so don't hesitate if you want to take part! If you have questions, please email. We look forward to seeing you online. Kind regards, RIPE NCC Training Services