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Re: ERX TF - Process

  • From: Kristian Rastas <
    > (by way of Local Internet Registry <
  • Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 15:19:45 +0300

Hello all,

some comments, questions and suggestions from our point of view, because we
have encountered same kind of questions and already done some preliminary
work for transfers.

At 20:19 15.10.2002, Hans Petter Holen wrote:
Mayby I should turn the question around: how do you suggest we should handle
this ?


----- Original Message -----
From: "Havard Eidnes" he@localhost
To: leo@localhost

Sent: Monday, October 14, 2002 11:29 PM
Subject: Re: ERX TF - Process


I have a couple of questions which may not be directly related to the
ERX process as such, but are "side issues", though, I think still
relevant to ask here:

 o Some early registrations may have been used for further assignments to
   different organizations, while others are "direct assignments" to
   organizations.  In the case of further re-assignments, it may be the
   case that these are not documented in the RIPE DB.  Will the early
   registrations be subject to the same registration policies that the
   later allocations done through the RIR system?
We think it should not be the most important thing at this phase. The policy
was very different during early -90's and we should separate these
as their own case. There were lots of so called "third party" assignments at that time and
we for example have many service providers as customers and we don't know anything
about their end customers at the monent.

The most effort should be put to get the "owner" data right and update
the database first and get the reverse delegations working. At least this
is the main problem here.

For example: We have a customer who has used Internic-space since Year 1993, but
no registration data exists in ARIN but there is a record in RIPE-DB.
ARIN doesn't regocnize this space as our LIR's allocation or assignment. How
do we update the reverse information ? Who will the RIR's trust ?
The information provided by LIR ? or customer ? or both depending on case ?

We as a LIR think the information provided by LIR's should be prioritized, because
they propaply have most of the information about their customers and maybe
some logs, too. If no information can be found, but someone is using/routing the address space,
what will the procedure then be ?

 (...and if the decision
   is that the policies should be aligned, can that be enforced...?)

 o The other relevant policy question relates to how this will influence
   address allocatin policies by the RIR, if at all.
We think it shouldn't, of course there will be more address space to be maintained
by LIR's but they haven't caused this situation at the first place.
This ERX-space should not be
counted as past allocation during this first phase (solving the registrations) if LIR is asking a new allocation from RIR. Maybe later, when all the assignments are up to date.

I bet a lot of folks holding early address space will be asking those
exact questions.
Yes, You are absolutely right. There are still more questions than answers but we think
this task force is a step to right direction. We might even tell You a "war story"
what has happened so far, the compilation of the facts will take some time though and
some of it is outdated already because of the ERX.

Best Regards,

Kristian Rastas, Sonera LIR (Finland)