[db-wg] [anti-abuse-wg] objection to RIPE policy proposal 2016-01

Hi Michele:

> On 4 Mar 2016, at 21:55, Michele Neylon - Blacknight <michele at blacknight.com> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> Hi there:
> 
> I think the whole notion about we are managing the internet though the policy are not correct.
> 
> We are not managing the internet, we are book keeping really.
> 
> Denis, your argument standing on a group that if we do not manage the internet, the gov will step in and do it for us, but that is largely untrue.
> 
> The Gov are managing it now as we speak, they have something called law to enforce things, they really don't need bother to go though policy here to block content they dislike, bust people they think are bad, find people are responsible, if there is a seriou crime going on, with or without abuse-c, gov will find them or not---abuse c does not change the outcome.
> 
> Take China for example,  500 m user can not access Facebook, tell me they go though any sort of APNIC policy to do that, same goes for some countries in Middle East.
> 
> So my last point is. If you like their gov job, you can apply one, don't try to push community here to do gov's job.
> Lu
> 
> Sorry, but I totally disagree with you.
> 
> If you run a network you are responsible for making resources available on the internet. That is a responsibility. 

I totally agree with you, as matter of evidence, if you look our range, we have very clear abuse reporting instructions.

> If you don’t want to deal with abuse complaints then you’ll find a lot of other network operators will start either blocking your network or blocking traffic to / from certain ports or via particular protocols.

That's very true.
> 
> The serious crime argument is total rubbish. What we all see on a daily basis is abuse of various types covering the full scope of “nasty” behaviour.
> 
> As for governments – just look what’s being going on in multiple jurisdictions. If industry doesn’t act responsibly we will be forced to and governments do a terrible job of handling internet related issues.

I think we have misunderstanding in this part, as I have explained in my last email, i don't think abuse c makes no difference for none crime abuse(spam for example is legal in some country). The operators cares has dealt with it already, the ops don't care, I really don't think ask them fill one extra line changes anything.

> 
> Regards
> 
> Michele
> 
> 
> --
> Mr Michele Neylon
> Blacknight Solutions
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