From sandro.parranca at anacom.pt Tue Apr 16 13:14:51 2013 From: sandro.parranca at anacom.pt (sandro.parranca at anacom.pt) Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 11:14:51 +0000 Subject: [cooperation-wg] Internet Enforcement Continued Coordination and Delivery Message-ID: <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253A4F@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT> Dear GEntleman, I am currently a delegate on the IECCD group for incident responses, investigation capabilities and stratagies for e-commerce fraudulent practicies. I find that one of the major dificulties are related with the tracking and finding the responsables for the fraudulent website. Specialy in a global domain. Shouln't this ipe's wg be participating in this process? On line investigations should be supported by the CSIRT's. Best rgs, SP Pense no ambiente. Imprima o conte?do desta mensagem apenas se for absolutamente necess?rio. Este email e ficheiros em anexo sao confidenciais e destinados somente ao conhecimento e utilizacao da(s) pessoa(s) ou entidade(s) a quem foram enderecados. Se recebeu este email ou anexos por erro, ou a eles teve acesso nao sendo o destinatario, por favor elimine-os contactando o remetente. Please consider the environment before printing this mail note. This email and files transmitted with it are confidential and intended for the sole use of the individual or organisation to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete it without using, copying, storing, forwarding or disclosing its contents to any other party. ICP-ANACOM - Autoridade Nacional de Comunicacoes http://www.anacom.pt From michele at blacknight.com Tue Apr 16 13:28:38 2013 From: michele at blacknight.com (Michele Neylon :: Blacknight) Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 11:28:38 +0000 Subject: [cooperation-wg] Internet Enforcement Continued Coordination and Delivery In-Reply-To: <20130416112145.7D51C5A4010@merlin.blacknight.ie> References: <20130416112145.7D51C5A4010@merlin.blacknight.ie> Message-ID: Sandro What would RIPE be doing exactly? Regards Michele On 16 Apr 2013, at 12:14, wrote: > Dear GEntleman, > > I am currently a delegate on the IECCD group for incident responses, investigation capabilities and stratagies for e-commerce fraudulent practicies. > > I find that one of the major dificulties are related with the tracking and finding the responsables for the fraudulent website. Specialy in a global domain. > > Shouln't this ipe's wg be participating in this process? > > On line investigations should be supported by the CSIRT's. > > Best rgs, > SP > > > > Pense no ambiente. Imprima o conte?do desta mensagem apenas se for absolutamente necess?rio. > > Este email e ficheiros em anexo sao confidenciais e destinados somente ao conhecimento e utilizacao da(s) pessoa(s) ou entidade(s) a quem foram enderecados. Se recebeu este email ou anexos por erro, ou a eles teve acesso nao sendo o destinatario, por favor elimine-os contactando o remetente. > > Please consider the environment before printing this mail note. > > This email and files transmitted with it are confidential and intended for the sole use of the individual or organisation to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete it without using, copying, storing, forwarding or disclosing its contents to any other party. > > ICP-ANACOM - Autoridade Nacional de Comunicacoes http://www.anacom.pt > Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions ? Hosting & Domains ICANN Accredited Registrar http://www.blacknight.co http://blog.blacknight.com/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 US: 213-233-1612 Locall: 1850 929 929 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 Facebook: http://fb.me/blacknight Twitter: http://twitter.com/mneylon ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 From paf at frobbit.se Tue Apr 16 16:40:51 2013 From: paf at frobbit.se (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Patrik_F=E4ltstr=F6m?=) Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 16:40:51 +0200 Subject: [cooperation-wg] Internet Enforcement Continued Coordination and Delivery In-Reply-To: <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253A4F@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT> References: <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253A4F@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT> Message-ID: Dear Sandro, I think what you bring up could be an excellent topic for discussion. Do other people on this list agree? Regards, Patrik F?ltstr?m Co-chair cooperation wg On 16 apr 2013, at 13:14, wrote: > Dear GEntleman, > > I am currently a delegate on the IECCD group for incident responses, investigation capabilities and stratagies for e-commerce fraudulent practicies. > > I find that one of the major dificulties are related with the tracking and finding the responsables for the fraudulent website. Specialy in a global domain. > > Shouln't this ipe's wg be participating in this process? > > On line investigations should be supported by the CSIRT's. > > Best rgs, > SP > > > > Pense no ambiente. Imprima o conte?do desta mensagem apenas se for absolutamente necess?rio. > > Este email e ficheiros em anexo sao confidenciais e destinados somente ao conhecimento e utilizacao da(s) pessoa(s) ou entidade(s) a quem foram enderecados. Se recebeu este email ou anexos por erro, ou a eles teve acesso nao sendo o destinatario, por favor elimine-os contactando o remetente. > > Please consider the environment before printing this mail note. > > This email and files transmitted with it are confidential and intended for the sole use of the individual or organisation to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete it without using, copying, storing, forwarding or disclosing its contents to any other party. > > ICP-ANACOM - Autoridade Nacional de Comunicacoes http://www.anacom.pt > From sandro.parranca at anacom.pt Tue Apr 16 16:50:10 2013 From: sandro.parranca at anacom.pt (sandro.parranca at anacom.pt) Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 14:50:10 +0000 Subject: [cooperation-wg] Internet Enforcement Continued Coordination and Delivery In-Reply-To: References: <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253A4F@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT>, Message-ID: <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253A7F@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT> Dear Patrick, I am going to talk with the people that are managing our workgroup. I will get back to you tomorrow. Thank You SP ________________________________________ From: Patrik F?ltstr?m [paf at frobbit.se] Sent: 16 April 2013 15:40 To: Sandro M. Parran?a Cc: cooperation-wg at ripe.net Subject: Re: [cooperation-wg] Internet Enforcement Continued Coordination and Delivery Dear Sandro, I think what you bring up could be an excellent topic for discussion. Do other people on this list agree? Regards, Patrik F?ltstr?m Co-chair cooperation wg On 16 apr 2013, at 13:14, wrote: > Dear GEntleman, > > I am currently a delegate on the IECCD group for incident responses, investigation capabilities and stratagies for e-commerce fraudulent practicies. > > I find that one of the major dificulties are related with the tracking and finding the responsables for the fraudulent website. Specialy in a global domain. > > Shouln't this ipe's wg be participating in this process? > > On line investigations should be supported by the CSIRT's. > > Best rgs, > SP > > > > Pense no ambiente. Imprima o conte?do desta mensagem apenas se for absolutamente necess?rio. > > Este email e ficheiros em anexo sao confidenciais e destinados somente ao conhecimento e utilizacao da(s) pessoa(s) ou entidade(s) a quem foram enderecados. Se recebeu este email ou anexos por erro, ou a eles teve acesso nao sendo o destinatario, por favor elimine-os contactando o remetente. > > Please consider the environment before printing this mail note. > > This email and files transmitted with it are confidential and intended for the sole use of the individual or organisation to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete it without using, copying, storing, forwarding or disclosing its contents to any other party. > > ICP-ANACOM - Autoridade Nacional de Comunicacoes http://www.anacom.pt > Pense no ambiente. Imprima o conte?do desta mensagem apenas se for absolutamente necess?rio. Este email e ficheiros em anexo sao confidenciais e destinados somente ao conhecimento e utilizacao da(s) pessoa(s) ou entidade(s) a quem foram enderecados. Se recebeu este email ou anexos por erro, ou a eles teve acesso nao sendo o destinatario, por favor elimine-os contactando o remetente. Please consider the environment before printing this mail note. This email and files transmitted with it are confidential and intended for the sole use of the individual or organisation to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete it without using, copying, storing, forwarding or disclosing its contents to any other party. ICP-ANACOM - Autoridade Nacional de Comunicacoes http://www.anacom.pt From paf at frobbit.se Tue Apr 16 17:02:50 2013 From: paf at frobbit.se (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Patrik_F=E4ltstr=F6m?=) Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 17:02:50 +0200 Subject: [cooperation-wg] Internet Enforcement Continued Coordination and Delivery In-Reply-To: <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253A7F@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT> References: <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253A4F@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT>, <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253A7F@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT> Message-ID: <92D41BF2-818E-4C95-B9E7-B56BF1FC8853@frobbit.se> Dear Sandro, The question from Michele is also important to think about before the meeting. What can the RIPE community help with? Patrik On 16 apr 2013, at 16:50, wrote: > Dear Patrick, > > I am going to talk with the people that are managing our workgroup. > > I will get back to you tomorrow. > > Thank You > SP > ________________________________________ > From: Patrik F?ltstr?m [paf at frobbit.se] > Sent: 16 April 2013 15:40 > To: Sandro M. Parran?a > Cc: cooperation-wg at ripe.net > Subject: Re: [cooperation-wg] Internet Enforcement Continued Coordination and Delivery > > Dear Sandro, > > I think what you bring up could be an excellent topic for discussion. > > Do other people on this list agree? > > Regards, > > Patrik F?ltstr?m > Co-chair cooperation wg > > On 16 apr 2013, at 13:14, wrote: > >> Dear GEntleman, >> >> I am currently a delegate on the IECCD group for incident responses, investigation capabilities and stratagies for e-commerce fraudulent practicies. >> >> I find that one of the major dificulties are related with the tracking and finding the responsables for the fraudulent website. Specialy in a global domain. >> >> Shouln't this ipe's wg be participating in this process? >> >> On line investigations should be supported by the CSIRT's. >> >> Best rgs, >> SP >> >> >> >> Pense no ambiente. Imprima o conte?do desta mensagem apenas se for absolutamente necess?rio. >> >> Este email e ficheiros em anexo sao confidenciais e destinados somente ao conhecimento e utilizacao da(s) pessoa(s) ou entidade(s) a quem foram enderecados. Se recebeu este email ou anexos por erro, ou a eles teve acesso nao sendo o destinatario, por favor elimine-os contactando o remetente. >> >> Please consider the environment before printing this mail note. >> >> This email and files transmitted with it are confidential and intended for the sole use of the individual or organisation to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete it without using, copying, storing, forwarding or disclosing its contents to any other party. >> >> ICP-ANACOM - Autoridade Nacional de Comunicacoes http://www.anacom.pt >> > > Pense no ambiente. Imprima o conte?do desta mensagem apenas se for absolutamente necess?rio. > > Este email e ficheiros em anexo sao confidenciais e destinados somente ao conhecimento e utilizacao da(s) pessoa(s) ou entidade(s) a quem foram enderecados. Se recebeu este email ou anexos por erro, ou a eles teve acesso nao sendo o destinatario, por favor elimine-os contactando o remetente. > > Please consider the environment before printing this mail note. > > This email and files transmitted with it are confidential and intended for the sole use of the individual or organisation to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete it without using, copying, storing, forwarding or disclosing its contents to any other party. > > ICP-ANACOM - Autoridade Nacional de Comunicacoes http://www.anacom.pt > From sandro.parranca at anacom.pt Tue Apr 16 17:21:48 2013 From: sandro.parranca at anacom.pt (sandro.parranca at anacom.pt) Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 15:21:48 +0000 Subject: [cooperation-wg] Internet Enforcement Continued Coordination and Delivery In-Reply-To: <92D41BF2-818E-4C95-B9E7-B56BF1FC8853@frobbit.se> References: <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253A4F@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT>, <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253A7F@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT>, <92D41BF2-818E-4C95-B9E7-B56BF1FC8853@frobbit.se> Message-ID: <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253A94@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT> Dear Patrick, I will present the question but I would like to invert it as an exercice and ask you if you think the RIPE community could represent an important role on helping the law enforcement agencys to pursuit and sanction the people that commit fraudulent activities on the Internet e.g. regarding ecommerce issues among other's scams? SP ________________________________________ From: Patrik F?ltstr?m [paf at frobbit.se] Sent: 16 April 2013 16:02 To: Sandro M. Parran?a Cc: cooperation-wg at ripe.net Subject: Re: [cooperation-wg] Internet Enforcement Continued Coordination and Delivery Dear Sandro, The question from Michele is also important to think about before the meeting. What can the RIPE community help with? Patrik On 16 apr 2013, at 16:50, wrote: > Dear Patrick, > > I am going to talk with the people that are managing our workgroup. > > I will get back to you tomorrow. > > Thank You > SP > ________________________________________ > From: Patrik F?ltstr?m [paf at frobbit.se] > Sent: 16 April 2013 15:40 > To: Sandro M. Parran?a > Cc: cooperation-wg at ripe.net > Subject: Re: [cooperation-wg] Internet Enforcement Continued Coordination and Delivery > > Dear Sandro, > > I think what you bring up could be an excellent topic for discussion. > > Do other people on this list agree? > > Regards, > > Patrik F?ltstr?m > Co-chair cooperation wg > > On 16 apr 2013, at 13:14, wrote: > >> Dear GEntleman, >> >> I am currently a delegate on the IECCD group for incident responses, investigation capabilities and stratagies for e-commerce fraudulent practicies. >> >> I find that one of the major dificulties are related with the tracking and finding the responsables for the fraudulent website. Specialy in a global domain. >> >> Shouln't this ipe's wg be participating in this process? >> >> On line investigations should be supported by the CSIRT's. >> >> Best rgs, >> SP >> >> >> >> Pense no ambiente. Imprima o conte?do desta mensagem apenas se for absolutamente necess?rio. >> >> Este email e ficheiros em anexo sao confidenciais e destinados somente ao conhecimento e utilizacao da(s) pessoa(s) ou entidade(s) a quem foram enderecados. Se recebeu este email ou anexos por erro, ou a eles teve acesso nao sendo o destinatario, por favor elimine-os contactando o remetente. >> >> Please consider the environment before printing this mail note. >> >> This email and files transmitted with it are confidential and intended for the sole use of the individual or organisation to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete it without using, copying, storing, forwarding or disclosing its contents to any other party. >> >> ICP-ANACOM - Autoridade Nacional de Comunicacoes http://www.anacom.pt >> > > Pense no ambiente. Imprima o conte?do desta mensagem apenas se for absolutamente necess?rio. > > Este email e ficheiros em anexo sao confidenciais e destinados somente ao conhecimento e utilizacao da(s) pessoa(s) ou entidade(s) a quem foram enderecados. Se recebeu este email ou anexos por erro, ou a eles teve acesso nao sendo o destinatario, por favor elimine-os contactando o remetente. > > Please consider the environment before printing this mail note. > > This email and files transmitted with it are confidential and intended for the sole use of the individual or organisation to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete it without using, copying, storing, forwarding or disclosing its contents to any other party. > > ICP-ANACOM - Autoridade Nacional de Comunicacoes http://www.anacom.pt > Pense no ambiente. Imprima o conte?do desta mensagem apenas se for absolutamente necess?rio. Este email e ficheiros em anexo sao confidenciais e destinados somente ao conhecimento e utilizacao da(s) pessoa(s) ou entidade(s) a quem foram enderecados. Se recebeu este email ou anexos por erro, ou a eles teve acesso nao sendo o destinatario, por favor elimine-os contactando o remetente. Please consider the environment before printing this mail note. This email and files transmitted with it are confidential and intended for the sole use of the individual or organisation to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete it without using, copying, storing, forwarding or disclosing its contents to any other party. ICP-ANACOM - Autoridade Nacional de Comunicacoes http://www.anacom.pt From sandro.parranca at anacom.pt Wed Apr 17 15:25:09 2013 From: sandro.parranca at anacom.pt (sandro.parranca at anacom.pt) Date: Wed, 17 Apr 2013 13:25:09 +0000 Subject: [cooperation-wg] Internet Enforcement Continued Coordination and Delivery In-Reply-To: <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253A94@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT> References: <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253A4F@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT>, <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253A7F@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT>, <92D41BF2-818E-4C95-B9E7-B56BF1FC8853@frobbit.se>, <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253A94@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT> Message-ID: <42E1CC695ABE1C4ABAD17127D7D8A28F15253B2A@HATSHEPSUT.ICP.PT> Hi Patrick, I have already talked with one of the people ahead of the IECCD group which showed interest on developing this approach. This person is Alain Kapper [Alain.Kapper at oft.gsi.gov.uk] from OFT UK which I think will contact you soon. Thank You Sandro Parranca ________________________________________ From: cooperation-wg-bounces at ripe.net [cooperation-wg-bounces at ripe.net] on behalf of sandro.parranca at anacom.pt [sandro.parranca at anacom.pt] Sent: 16 April 2013 16:21 To: paf at frobbit.se Cc: cooperation-wg at ripe.net Subject: Re: [cooperation-wg] Internet Enforcement Continued Coordination and Delivery Dear Patrick, I will present the question but I would like to invert it as an exercice and ask you if you think the RIPE community could represent an important role on helping the law enforcement agencys to pursuit and sanction the people that commit fraudulent activities on the Internet e.g. regarding ecommerce issues among other's scams? SP ________________________________________ From: Patrik F?ltstr?m [paf at frobbit.se] Sent: 16 April 2013 16:02 To: Sandro M. Parran?a Cc: cooperation-wg at ripe.net Subject: Re: [cooperation-wg] Internet Enforcement Continued Coordination and Delivery Dear Sandro, The question from Michele is also important to think about before the meeting. What can the RIPE community help with? Patrik On 16 apr 2013, at 16:50, wrote: > Dear Patrick, > > I am going to talk with the people that are managing our workgroup. > > I will get back to you tomorrow. > > Thank You > SP > ________________________________________ > From: Patrik F?ltstr?m [paf at frobbit.se] > Sent: 16 April 2013 15:40 > To: Sandro M. Parran?a > Cc: cooperation-wg at ripe.net > Subject: Re: [cooperation-wg] Internet Enforcement Continued Coordination and Delivery > > Dear Sandro, > > I think what you bring up could be an excellent topic for discussion. > > Do other people on this list agree? > > Regards, > > Patrik F?ltstr?m > Co-chair cooperation wg > > On 16 apr 2013, at 13:14, wrote: > >> Dear GEntleman, >> >> I am currently a delegate on the IECCD group for incident responses, investigation capabilities and stratagies for e-commerce fraudulent practicies. >> >> I find that one of the major dificulties are related with the tracking and finding the responsables for the fraudulent website. Specialy in a global domain. >> >> Shouln't this ipe's wg be participating in this process? >> >> On line investigations should be supported by the CSIRT's. >> >> Best rgs, >> SP >> >> >> >> Pense no ambiente. Imprima o conte?do desta mensagem apenas se for absolutamente necess?rio. >> >> Este email e ficheiros em anexo sao confidenciais e destinados somente ao conhecimento e utilizacao da(s) pessoa(s) ou entidade(s) a quem foram enderecados. Se recebeu este email ou anexos por erro, ou a eles teve acesso nao sendo o destinatario, por favor elimine-os contactando o remetente. >> >> Please consider the environment before printing this mail note. >> >> This email and files transmitted with it are confidential and intended for the sole use of the individual or organisation to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete it without using, copying, storing, forwarding or disclosing its contents to any other party. >> >> ICP-ANACOM - Autoridade Nacional de Comunicacoes http://www.anacom.pt >> > > Pense no ambiente. Imprima o conte?do desta mensagem apenas se for absolutamente necess?rio. > > Este email e ficheiros em anexo sao confidenciais e destinados somente ao conhecimento e utilizacao da(s) pessoa(s) ou entidade(s) a quem foram enderecados. Se recebeu este email ou anexos por erro, ou a eles teve acesso nao sendo o destinatario, por favor elimine-os contactando o remetente. > > Please consider the environment before printing this mail note. > > This email and files transmitted with it are confidential and intended for the sole use of the individual or organisation to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete it without using, copying, storing, forwarding or disclosing its contents to any other party. > > ICP-ANACOM - Autoridade Nacional de Comunicacoes http://www.anacom.pt > Pense no ambiente. Imprima o conte?do desta mensagem apenas se for absolutamente necess?rio. Este email e ficheiros em anexo sao confidenciais e destinados somente ao conhecimento e utilizacao da(s) pessoa(s) ou entidade(s) a quem foram enderecados. Se recebeu este email ou anexos por erro, ou a eles teve acesso nao sendo o destinatario, por favor elimine-os contactando o remetente. Please consider the environment before printing this mail note. This email and files transmitted with it are confidential and intended for the sole use of the individual or organisation to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete it without using, copying, storing, forwarding or disclosing its contents to any other party. ICP-ANACOM - Autoridade Nacional de Comunicacoes http://www.anacom.pt Pense no ambiente. Imprima o conte?do desta mensagem apenas se for absolutamente necess?rio. Este email e ficheiros em anexo sao confidenciais e destinados somente ao conhecimento e utilizacao da(s) pessoa(s) ou entidade(s) a quem foram enderecados. Se recebeu este email ou anexos por erro, ou a eles teve acesso nao sendo o destinatario, por favor elimine-os contactando o remetente. Please consider the environment before printing this mail note. This email and files transmitted with it are confidential and intended for the sole use of the individual or organisation to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete it without using, copying, storing, forwarding or disclosing its contents to any other party. ICP-ANACOM - Autoridade Nacional de Comunicacoes http://www.anacom.pt From patrik at frobbit.se Mon Apr 22 10:00:07 2013 From: patrik at frobbit.se (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Patrik_F=E4ltstr=F6m?=) Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2013 10:00:07 +0200 Subject: [cooperation-wg] EU proposa on qualified signatures Message-ID: <7A22C454-44EE-413F-97C8-4764C16FF4C3@frobbit.se> All, There is as some of you might know a discussion in EU related to e-ID and a new proposed regulation on trust services. One summary of the situation is made by member of the European Parliament Amelia Andersdotter that criticizes the proposal that is on the table for the parliament. I have personally had problems with the original directive, and this proposal even more as it tries to enforce onto people and organisations who to trust. Or more specifically, who you should trust as a trusted third party. I think federated solutions are better as "one size does not fit all", and with federated solutions one can more easily build services the way "it was intended" on the Internet. Anyway, here is the summary by Amelia, and maybe we should spend some time on this in Dublin, if people are interested? http://ameliaandersdotter.eu/eid-and-trust-services-regulation/ Patrik From vesely at tana.it Mon Apr 22 15:29:22 2013 From: vesely at tana.it (Alessandro Vesely) Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2013 15:29:22 +0200 Subject: [cooperation-wg] Comment on eid-and-trust-services-regulation Message-ID: <51753B32.7010305@tana.it> Amelia, I read your blog (see link in the post below) and wish to thank you for your work and for your amendments to the eIDSA. In particular, I support how you'd move art. 11 to art. 4a and the additions brought there. It seems that, if techniques like OAuth 2.0 or similar --based on pseudonyms like email addresses-- take root, then mailbox providers may become the trust service providers of choice for a number of mundane transactions, including shopping and subscriptions to newsletters and mailing lists. The ability to generate pseudonyms ad-hoc (the part before the "@") can allow complete anonymity, and possibly trace unwanted leakage of the pseudonym itself. In addition, a provider chosen by the data subjects can register such transactions on their behalf: Any other method for acquiring consent ends up being registered on the processor's side only, which I consider unfair of Directive 95/46/EC. Regards A mailbox provider -------- Original Message -------- From: Patrik F?ltstr?m Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2013 10:00:07 +0200 To: cooperation-wg at ripe.net Subject: [cooperation-wg] EU proposa on qualified signatures All, There is as some of you might know a discussion in EU related to e-ID and a new proposed regulation on trust services. One summary of the situation is made by member of the European Parliament Amelia Andersdotter that criticizes the proposal that is on the table for the parliament. I have personally had problems with the original directive, and this proposal even more as it tries to enforce onto people and organisations who to trust. Or more specifically, who you should trust as a trusted third party. I think federated solutions are better as "one size does not fit all", and with federated solutions one can more easily build services the way "it was intended" on the Internet. Anyway, here is the summary by Amelia, and maybe we should spend some time on this in Dublin, if people are interested? http://ameliaandersdotter.eu/eid-and-trust-services-regulation/ Patrik From amelia.andersdotter at europarl.europa.eu Mon Apr 22 18:15:00 2013 From: amelia.andersdotter at europarl.europa.eu (ANDERSDOTTER Amelia) Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2013 16:15:00 +0000 Subject: [cooperation-wg] Comment on eid-and-trust-services-regulation In-Reply-To: <51753B32.7010305@tana.it> References: <51753B32.7010305@tana.it> Message-ID: <28FE816B96D80F408D7A7A9AD1BF737B10557A@UCEXLWP009.ep.parl.union.eu> Dear Alessandro, Thank you for your comments. I hope that we will be able to have a broader support for these changes in the European Parliament and the Council of Ministers. Would I be able to make references to you when speaking with other MEP:s? I think it might help for me, at least, if I can point to the support of other groups for these amendments. In the end, it might also help if you are able to get in touch with MEPs and speak with them directly. If you are aware of your national government representatives in Brussels who are working with these topics, they could also be useful. My amendments are quite far from the original formulations by the European Commission, but I feel they support the same spirit - accountability, transparency, privacy and appropriately allocated liability to all parties in the chain. The relevant Commission unit is led by Andrea Servida, who may therefore also be approached. Best regards, Amelia -----Original Message----- From: Alessandro Vesely [mailto:vesely at tana.it] Sent: 22 April 2013 15:29 To: ANDERSDOTTER Amelia Cc: cooperation-wg Subject: Comment on eid-and-trust-services-regulation Amelia, I read your blog (see link in the post below) and wish to thank you for your work and for your amendments to the eIDSA. In particular, I support how you'd move art. 11 to art. 4a and the additions brought there. It seems that, if techniques like OAuth 2.0 or similar --based on pseudonyms like email addresses-- take root, then mailbox providers may become the trust service providers of choice for a number of mundane transactions, including shopping and subscriptions to newsletters and mailing lists. The ability to generate pseudonyms ad-hoc (the part before the "@") can allow complete anonymity, and possibly trace unwanted leakage of the pseudonym itself. In addition, a provider chosen by the data subjects can register such transactions on their behalf: Any other method for acquiring consent ends up being registered on the processor's side only, which I consider unfair of Directive 95/46/EC. Regards A mailbox provider -------- Original Message -------- From: Patrik F?ltstr?m Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2013 10:00:07 +0200 To: cooperation-wg at ripe.net Subject: [cooperation-wg] EU proposa on qualified signatures All, There is as some of you might know a discussion in EU related to e-ID and a new proposed regulation on trust services. One summary of the situation is made by member of the European Parliament Amelia Andersdotter that criticizes the proposal that is on the table for the parliament. I have personally had problems with the original directive, and this proposal even more as it tries to enforce onto people and organisations who to trust. Or more specifically, who you should trust as a trusted third party. I think federated solutions are better as "one size does not fit all", and with federated solutions one can more easily build services the way "it was intended" on the Internet. Anyway, here is the summary by Amelia, and maybe we should spend some time on this in Dublin, if people are interested? http://ameliaandersdotter.eu/eid-and-trust-services-regulation/ Patrik From ripencc-management at ripe.net Tue Apr 23 10:25:04 2013 From: ripencc-management at ripe.net (Paul Rendek) Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2013 10:25:04 +0200 Subject: [cooperation-wg] RIRs Publish Response to ITU WTPF Opinions on Internet Governance References: Message-ID: [Apologies for duplicates] Dear colleagues, The International Telecommunication Union (ITU) will hold the Fifth World Telecommunication/ICT Policy Forum (WTPF) in Geneva this May. This event is being convened specifically to look at Internet-related public policy matters. The primary input document to this meeting is a report by the ITU Secretary General, including six Opinions agreed to by an Informal Experts Group (IEG) that met three times over the past year. These Opinions touch on issues including management of Internet number resources, encouraging IPv6 adoption, support for Internet Exchange Points (IXPs), multi-stakeholder governance and Enhanced Cooperation. The five Regional Internet Registries (RIRs) have drafted responses to the five Opinions that relate directly to the RIRs' areas of expertise and coordination. A document containing these responses has been published at: http://www.nro.net/wp-content/uploads/RIR_WTPF13_2.pdf The full Secretary General's report (including the six Opinions) is available at: http://www.itu.int/md/S13-WTPF13-C-0003/en I invite you to post any questions or comments regarding this document to the RIPE Cooperation Working Group mailing list (cooperation-wg at ripe.net). Best regards, Paul Rendek Director of External Relations, RIPE NCC From gordon.lennox.13 at gmail.com Tue Apr 23 10:51:12 2013 From: gordon.lennox.13 at gmail.com (Gordon Lennox) Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2013 10:51:12 +0200 Subject: [cooperation-wg] EU proposa on qualified signatures In-Reply-To: <7A22C454-44EE-413F-97C8-4764C16FF4C3@frobbit.se> References: <7A22C454-44EE-413F-97C8-4764C16FF4C3@frobbit.se> Message-ID: <992B844D-F438-4B98-AACA-1AEF885A5228@gmail.com> Just to add a little to what Patrik wrote. This concerns a proposal for a Regulation and not for a Directive. The essential difference is that a Directive has to be transposed into national law and so there is another local stage. A Regulation on the other hand is directly applicable: the adopted text will be the applicable law in each EU Member State. The Commission's proposed regulation is actually quite wide ranging - covering identification, signatures of various kinds, seals, time stamps, delivery services, website authentication and so on - and refers to a whole range of activities. My feeling is that a presentation / discussion in Dublin would be very useful for very many people. Maybe the co-chairs could try and get somebody from Brussels. Gordon From nick at inex.ie Tue Apr 23 16:09:31 2013 From: nick at inex.ie (Nick Hilliard) Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2013 15:09:31 +0100 Subject: [cooperation-wg] [ncc-announce] [news] RIRs Publish Response to ITU WTPF Opinions on Internet Governance In-Reply-To: <1FA39AB7-DE73-4C32-A501-F88416D27C54@ripe.net> References: <1FA39AB7-DE73-4C32-A501-F88416D27C54@ripe.net> Message-ID: <5176961B.4050404@inex.ie> Paul, The various IXP associations may be interested in working with the NROs on a statement on Option 1: "Promoting Internet Exchange Points (IXPs) as a long term solution to advance connectivity". As it stands, the RIR_WTPF13_2 document suggests that the NRO gives the ITU blanket support for their position: "The RIRs support this Opinion." There are pre-existing structures in place for fostering IXP growth, and the ITU's involvement in creating new structures would probably be quite unhelpful. Nick On 23/04/2013 09:34, Paul Rendek wrote: > [Apologies for duplicates] > > Dear colleagues, > > The International Telecommunication Union (ITU) will hold the Fifth World Telecommunication/ICT Policy Forum (WTPF) in Geneva this May. This event is being convened specifically to look at Internet-related public policy matters. > > The primary input document to this meeting is a report by the ITU Secretary General, including six Opinions agreed to by an Informal Experts Group (IEG) that met three times over the past year. These Opinions touch on issues including management of Internet number resources, encouraging IPv6 adoption, support for Internet Exchange Points (IXPs), multi-stakeholder governance and Enhanced Cooperation. > > The five Regional Internet Registries (RIRs) have drafted responses to the five Opinions that relate directly to the RIRs' areas of expertise and coordination. A document containing these responses has been published at: > http://www.nro.net/wp-content/uploads/RIR_WTPF13_2.pdf > > The full Secretary General's report (including the six Opinions) is available at: > http://www.itu.int/md/S13-WTPF13-C-0003/en > > I invite you to post any questions or comments regarding this document to the RIPE Cooperation Working Group mailing list (cooperation-wg at ripe.net). > > Best regards, > > Paul Rendek > Director of External Relations, RIPE NCC > > > > From rendek at ripe.net Tue Apr 23 16:40:16 2013 From: rendek at ripe.net (Paul Rendek) Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2013 18:40:16 +0400 Subject: [cooperation-wg] [ncc-announce] [news] RIRs Publish Response to ITU WTPF Opinions on Internet Governance In-Reply-To: <5176961B.4050404@inex.ie> References: <1FA39AB7-DE73-4C32-A501-F88416D27C54@ripe.net> <5176961B.4050404@inex.ie> Message-ID: <51769D50.30302@ripe.net> Hello Nick, Thanks very much for your suggestion. While we will submit the text, we plan to speak further to it during the WTPF and will highlight the role of regional peering groups. There is a reason that we did not provide a more detailed response to Opinion 1. An initial response on this opinion was given by ISOC and I believe they intend to submit a more thorough response to this particular opinion. I suggest you speak further with ISOC regarding their planned text submission on Opinion 1. Please contact Sally Wentworth @ ISOC about this. She can be reached at and I have CC'd her in this message. I look forward to seeing you in Dublin. Cheers, Paul On 4/23/13 6:09 PM, Nick Hilliard wrote: > Paul, > > The various IXP associations may be interested in working with the NROs on > a statement on Option 1: "Promoting Internet Exchange Points (IXPs) as a > long term solution to advance connectivity". > > As it stands, the RIR_WTPF13_2 document suggests that the NRO gives the ITU > blanket support for their position: "The RIRs support this Opinion." > > There are pre-existing structures in place for fostering IXP growth, and > the ITU's involvement in creating new structures would probably be quite > unhelpful. > > Nick > > On 23/04/2013 09:34, Paul Rendek wrote: >> [Apologies for duplicates] >> >> Dear colleagues, >> >> The International Telecommunication Union (ITU) will hold the Fifth World Telecommunication/ICT Policy Forum (WTPF) in Geneva this May. This event is being convened specifically to look at Internet-related public policy matters. >> >> The primary input document to this meeting is a report by the ITU Secretary General, including six Opinions agreed to by an Informal Experts Group (IEG) that met three times over the past year. These Opinions touch on issues including management of Internet number resources, encouraging IPv6 adoption, support for Internet Exchange Points (IXPs), multi-stakeholder governance and Enhanced Cooperation. >> >> The five Regional Internet Registries (RIRs) have drafted responses to the five Opinions that relate directly to the RIRs' areas of expertise and coordination. A document containing these responses has been published at: >> http://www.nro.net/wp-content/uploads/RIR_WTPF13_2.pdf >> >> The full Secretary General's report (including the six Opinions) is available at: >> http://www.itu.int/md/S13-WTPF13-C-0003/en >> >> I invite you to post any questions or comments regarding this document to the RIPE Cooperation Working Group mailing list (cooperation-wg at ripe.net). >> >> Best regards, >> >> Paul Rendek >> Director of External Relations, RIPE NCC >> >> >> >> > From kurtis at kurtis.pp.se Wed Apr 24 10:15:27 2013 From: kurtis at kurtis.pp.se (Lindqvist Kurt Erik) Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2013 10:15:27 +0200 Subject: [cooperation-wg] [ncc-announce] [news] RIRs Publish Response to ITU WTPF Opinions on Internet Governance In-Reply-To: <51769D50.30302@ripe.net> References: <1FA39AB7-DE73-4C32-A501-F88416D27C54@ripe.net> <5176961B.4050404@inex.ie> <51769D50.30302@ripe.net> Message-ID: On 23 apr 2013, at 16:40, Paul Rendek wrote: > Thanks very much for your suggestion. While we will submit the text, we plan to speak further to it during the WTPF and will highlight the role of regional peering groups. > > There is a reason that we did not provide a more detailed response to Opinion 1. An initial response on this opinion was given by ISOC and I believe they intend to submit a more thorough response to this particular opinion. I suggest you speak further with ISOC regarding their planned text submission on Opinion 1. > > Please contact Sally Wentworth @ ISOC about this. She can be reached at and I have CC'd her in this message. > > I look forward to seeing you in Dublin. I think the NRO text is troubling. It talks about multistakerholderism but it fails to invite, or as I would prefer recommend (not to say demand) that the ITU work and support inside existing frameworks rather than create competing efforts. I think it's important that this is clearly spelled out and not just talked over or mentioned. If the NRO isn't changing this statement (that I think is far from clear) then I really hope that ISOC includes this and stresses the importance of the ITU not working against or outside established and well working efforts. Best regards, - kurtis - From Martin.Boyle at nominet.org.uk Wed Apr 24 11:03:10 2013 From: Martin.Boyle at nominet.org.uk (Martin Boyle) Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2013 09:03:10 +0000 Subject: [cooperation-wg] [ncc-announce] [news] RIRs Publish Response to ITU WTPF Opinions on Internet Governance In-Reply-To: References: <1FA39AB7-DE73-4C32-A501-F88416D27C54@ripe.net> <5176961B.4050404@inex.ie> <51769D50.30302@ripe.net> Message-ID: <4ED5D5CBDF5F3E499DB990B095F010FE269B8624@wds-exc1.okna.nominet.org.uk> +1 -----Original Message----- From: cooperation-wg-bounces at ripe.net [mailto:cooperation-wg-bounces at ripe.net] On Behalf Of Lindqvist Kurt Erik Sent: 24 April 2013 09:15 To: Paul Rendek Cc: cooperation-wg at ripe.net; Sally Wentworth Subject: Re: [cooperation-wg] [ncc-announce] [news] RIRs Publish Response to ITU WTPF Opinions on Internet Governance On 23 apr 2013, at 16:40, Paul Rendek wrote: > Thanks very much for your suggestion. While we will submit the text, we plan to speak further to it during the WTPF and will highlight the role of regional peering groups. > > There is a reason that we did not provide a more detailed response to Opinion 1. An initial response on this opinion was given by ISOC and I believe they intend to submit a more thorough response to this particular opinion. I suggest you speak further with ISOC regarding their planned text submission on Opinion 1. > > Please contact Sally Wentworth @ ISOC about this. She can be reached at and I have CC'd her in this message. > > I look forward to seeing you in Dublin. I think the NRO text is troubling. It talks about multistakerholderism but it fails to invite, or as I would prefer recommend (not to say demand) that the ITU work and support inside existing frameworks rather than create competing efforts. I think it's important that this is clearly spelled out and not just talked over or mentioned. If the NRO isn't changing this statement (that I think is far from clear) then I really hope that ISOC includes this and stresses the importance of the ITU not working against or outside established and well working efforts. Best regards, - kurtis - From bastiaan.goslings at ams-ix.net Wed Apr 24 11:10:32 2013 From: bastiaan.goslings at ams-ix.net (Bastiaan Goslings) Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2013 11:10:32 +0200 Subject: [cooperation-wg] [ncc-announce] [news] RIRs Publish Response to ITU WTPF Opinions on Internet Governance In-Reply-To: <4ED5D5CBDF5F3E499DB990B095F010FE269B8624@wds-exc1.okna.nominet.org.uk> References: <1FA39AB7-DE73-4C32-A501-F88416D27C54@ripe.net> <5176961B.4050404@inex.ie> <51769D50.30302@ripe.net> <4ED5D5CBDF5F3E499DB990B095F010FE269B8624@wds-exc1.okna.nominet.org.uk> Message-ID: <78AD3F7E-F866-4362-B16A-75ECE9CBB23A@ams-ix.net> I agree as well - I stated simular worries earlier towards the Dutch delegation re draft opinion #1 -Bastiaan Skickat fr?n min iPad On Apr 24, 2013, at 11:03, Martin Boyle wrote: > +1 > > -----Original Message----- > From: cooperation-wg-bounces at ripe.net [mailto:cooperation-wg-bounces at ripe.net] On Behalf Of Lindqvist Kurt Erik > Sent: 24 April 2013 09:15 > To: Paul Rendek > Cc: cooperation-wg at ripe.net; Sally Wentworth > Subject: Re: [cooperation-wg] [ncc-announce] [news] RIRs Publish Response to ITU WTPF Opinions on Internet Governance > > > On 23 apr 2013, at 16:40, Paul Rendek wrote: > >> Thanks very much for your suggestion. While we will submit the text, we plan to speak further to it during the WTPF and will highlight the role of regional peering groups. >> >> There is a reason that we did not provide a more detailed response to Opinion 1. An initial response on this opinion was given by ISOC and I believe they intend to submit a more thorough response to this particular opinion. I suggest you speak further with ISOC regarding their planned text submission on Opinion 1. >> >> Please contact Sally Wentworth @ ISOC about this. She can be reached at and I have CC'd her in this message. >> >> I look forward to seeing you in Dublin. > > I think the NRO text is troubling. It talks about multistakerholderism but it fails to invite, or as I would prefer recommend (not to say demand) that the ITU work and support inside existing frameworks rather than create competing efforts. I think it's important that this is clearly spelled out and not just talked over or mentioned. If the NRO isn't changing this statement (that I think is far from clear) then I really hope that ISOC includes this and stresses the importance of the ITU not working against or outside established and well working efforts. > > Best regards, > > - kurtis - > > > > > > From jim at rfc1035.com Wed Apr 24 12:11:03 2013 From: jim at rfc1035.com (Jim Reid) Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2013 11:11:03 +0100 Subject: [cooperation-wg] [ncc-announce] [news] RIRs Publish Response to ITU WTPF Opinions on Internet Governance In-Reply-To: References: <1FA39AB7-DE73-4C32-A501-F88416D27C54@ripe.net> <5176961B.4050404@inex.ie> <51769D50.30302@ripe.net> Message-ID: On 24 Apr 2013, at 09:15, Lindqvist Kurt Erik wrote: > I think the NRO text is troubling. It talks about multistakerholderism but it fails to invite, or as I would prefer recommend (not to say demand) that the ITU work and support inside existing frameworks rather than create competing efforts. I think it's important that this is clearly spelled out and not just talked over or mentioned. If the NRO isn't changing this statement (that I think is far from clear) then I really hope that ISOC includes this and stresses the importance of the ITU not working against or outside established and well working efforts. +100 One sentence is particularly disappointing and IMO should not have been there: "ITU members should build on these initial steps to take this evolution to the next level ? an all-encompassing multistakeholder ITU will be essential to the organization's future relevance and authority." If it's not too late, I hope it can be removed because it does not come across as something which helps to foster a co-operative relationship. Imagine how we'd react if the ITU used similar megaphone diplomacy to tell us how RIPE had to radically re-organise its business and procedures to ensure RIPE's future relevance and authority. It's not clear to me if an evolving, all-encompassing multistakeholder ITU would be a Good Thing either, but let that pass. From Constanze.Buerger at bmi.bund.de Wed Apr 24 15:51:36 2013 From: Constanze.Buerger at bmi.bund.de (Constanze.Buerger at bmi.bund.de) Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2013 15:51:36 +0200 Subject: [cooperation-wg] [ncc-announce] [news] RIRs Publish Response to ITU WTPF Opinions on Internet Governance References: <1FA39AB7-DE73-4C32-A501-F88416D27C54@ripe.net><5176961B.4050404@inex.ie> <51769D50.30302@ripe.net> Message-ID: dear all, we are going on to check, what we can do from gov site. regards constanze ____________________________ Constanze B?rger Dipl.Inform.??? ??????? ??????? Referat IT 5, IT-Infrastrukturen und? IT-Sicherheitsmanagement des Bundes Bundesministerium des Innern??? Hausanschrift: Alt-Moabit 101 D; 10559 Berlin?????????????????????? Besucheranschrift: Bundesallee 216-218; 10719 Berlin DEUTSCHLAND Telefon: +4930186814357 Fax:???? +49301868159090 Mobil:? +4916090872556 E-Mail: constanze.buerger at bmi.bund.de Internet: www.bmi.bund.de, http://www.cio.bund.de -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: cooperation-wg-bounces at ripe.net [mailto:cooperation-wg-bounces at ripe.net] Im Auftrag von Paul Rendek Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. April 2013 16:40 An: cooperation-wg at ripe.net; nick at inex.ie; Sally Wentworth Betreff: Re: [cooperation-wg] [ncc-announce] [news] RIRs Publish Response to ITU WTPF Opinions on Internet Governance Hello Nick, Thanks very much for your suggestion. While we will submit the text, we plan to speak further to it during the WTPF and will highlight the role of regional peering groups. There is a reason that we did not provide a more detailed response to Opinion 1. An initial response on this opinion was given by ISOC and I believe they intend to submit a more thorough response to this particular opinion. I suggest you speak further with ISOC regarding their planned text submission on Opinion 1. Please contact Sally Wentworth @ ISOC about this. She can be reached at and I have CC'd her in this message. I look forward to seeing you in Dublin. Cheers, Paul On 4/23/13 6:09 PM, Nick Hilliard wrote: > Paul, > > The various IXP associations may be interested in working with the NROs on > a statement on Option 1: "Promoting Internet Exchange Points (IXPs) as a > long term solution to advance connectivity". > > As it stands, the RIR_WTPF13_2 document suggests that the NRO gives the ITU > blanket support for their position: "The RIRs support this Opinion." > > There are pre-existing structures in place for fostering IXP growth, and > the ITU's involvement in creating new structures would probably be quite > unhelpful. > > Nick > > On 23/04/2013 09:34, Paul Rendek wrote: >> [Apologies for duplicates] >> >> Dear colleagues, >> >> The International Telecommunication Union (ITU) will hold the Fifth World Telecommunication/ICT Policy Forum (WTPF) in Geneva this May. This event is being convened specifically to look at Internet-related public policy matters. >> >> The primary input document to this meeting is a report by the ITU Secretary General, including six Opinions agreed to by an Informal Experts Group (IEG) that met three times over the past year. These Opinions touch on issues including management of Internet number resources, encouraging IPv6 adoption, support for Internet Exchange Points (IXPs), multi-stakeholder governance and Enhanced Cooperation. >> >> The five Regional Internet Registries (RIRs) have drafted responses to the five Opinions that relate directly to the RIRs' areas of expertise and coordination. A document containing these responses has been published at: >> http://www.nro.net/wp-content/uploads/RIR_WTPF13_2.pdf >> >> The full Secretary General's report (including the six Opinions) is available at: >> http://www.itu.int/md/S13-WTPF13-C-0003/en >> >> I invite you to post any questions or comments regarding this document to the RIPE Cooperation Working Group mailing list (cooperation-wg at ripe.net). >> >> Best regards, >> >> Paul Rendek >> Director of External Relations, RIPE NCC >> >> >> >> > From rendek at ripe.net Thu Apr 25 17:14:54 2013 From: rendek at ripe.net (Paul Rendek) Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2013 19:14:54 +0400 Subject: [cooperation-wg] [ncc-announce] [news] RIRs Publish Response to ITU WTPF Opinions on Internet Governance In-Reply-To: <78AD3F7E-F866-4362-B16A-75ECE9CBB23A@ams-ix.net> References: <1FA39AB7-DE73-4C32-A501-F88416D27C54@ripe.net> <5176961B.4050404@inex.ie> <51769D50.30302@ripe.net> <4ED5D5CBDF5F3E499DB990B095F010FE269B8624@wds-exc1.okna.nominet.org.uk> <78AD3F7E-F866-4362-B16A-75ECE9CBB23A@ams-ix.net> Message-ID: <5179486E.8080803@ripe.net> Hello All, Thanks very much for your comments. I can see your point and I ahve had some discussions with Bijal (Euro-IX) who said she would work on some text that we can use to address your concerns. This text I think should be coordinated together with ISOC if they plan to provide a more detailed submission to Opinion 1. I await your text suggestion, but please be aware that time is now not on our side and I will need to have all five RIRs agree this text. If I cannot get text that suits in time we might have to consider removing any submission from the RIRs to Opinion 1. This may be better than a contribution that is not suitable for our community. Cheers, Paul On 4/24/13 1:10 PM, Bastiaan Goslings wrote: > I agree as well - I stated simular worries earlier towards the Dutch delegation re draft opinion #1 > > -Bastiaan > > Skickat fr?n min iPad > > On Apr 24, 2013, at 11:03, Martin Boyle wrote: > >> +1 >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: cooperation-wg-bounces at ripe.net [mailto:cooperation-wg-bounces at ripe.net] On Behalf Of Lindqvist Kurt Erik >> Sent: 24 April 2013 09:15 >> To: Paul Rendek >> Cc: cooperation-wg at ripe.net; Sally Wentworth >> Subject: Re: [cooperation-wg] [ncc-announce] [news] RIRs Publish Response to ITU WTPF Opinions on Internet Governance >> >> >> On 23 apr 2013, at 16:40, Paul Rendek wrote: >> >>> Thanks very much for your suggestion. While we will submit the text, we plan to speak further to it during the WTPF and will highlight the role of regional peering groups. >>> >>> There is a reason that we did not provide a more detailed response to Opinion 1. An initial response on this opinion was given by ISOC and I believe they intend to submit a more thorough response to this particular opinion. I suggest you speak further with ISOC regarding their planned text submission on Opinion 1. >>> >>> Please contact Sally Wentworth @ ISOC about this. She can be reached at and I have CC'd her in this message. >>> >>> I look forward to seeing you in Dublin. >> I think the NRO text is troubling. It talks about multistakerholderism but it fails to invite, or as I would prefer recommend (not to say demand) that the ITU work and support inside existing frameworks rather than create competing efforts. I think it's important that this is clearly spelled out and not just talked over or mentioned. If the NRO isn't changing this statement (that I think is far from clear) then I really hope that ISOC includes this and stresses the importance of the ITU not working against or outside established and well working efforts. >> >> Best regards, >> >> - kurtis - >> >> >> >> >> >> From patrik at frobbit.se Fri Apr 26 12:27:08 2013 From: patrik at frobbit.se (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Patrik_F=E4ltstr=F6m?=) Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2013 12:27:08 +0200 Subject: [cooperation-wg] EU proposa on qualified signatures In-Reply-To: <992B844D-F438-4B98-AACA-1AEF885A5228@gmail.com> References: <7A22C454-44EE-413F-97C8-4764C16FF4C3@frobbit.se> <992B844D-F438-4B98-AACA-1AEF885A5228@gmail.com> Message-ID: On 23 apr 2013, at 10:51, Gordon Lennox wrote: > My feeling is that a presentation / discussion in Dublin would be very useful for very many people. Point taken. I have gathered some material on this subject and if not someone else is stepping forward I can try to introduce the subject. > Maybe the co-chairs could try and get somebody from Brussels. I have invited Andrea Servida that I understand do understand the subject. Patrik From bijal.sanghani at euro-ix.net Fri Apr 26 16:46:39 2013 From: bijal.sanghani at euro-ix.net (Bijal Sanghani) Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2013 15:46:39 +0100 Subject: [cooperation-wg] [ncc-announce] [news] RIRs Publish Response to ITU WTPF Opinions on Internet Governance In-Reply-To: <5179486E.8080803@ripe.net> References: <1FA39AB7-DE73-4C32-A501-F88416D27C54@ripe.net> <5176961B.4050404@inex.ie> <51769D50.30302@ripe.net> <4ED5D5CBDF5F3E499DB990B095F010FE269B8624@wds-exc1.okna.nominet.org.uk> <78AD3F7E-F866-4362-B16A-75ECE9CBB23A@ams-ix.net> <5179486E.8080803@ripe.net> Message-ID: Dear All, Firstly thanks to Paul and the RIPE NCC for giving us the opportunity to work on the text, this is a great example of the community coming together to work on something we feel passionate about! With input from Patrik Falstrom and Nick Hilliard I would like to propose the following revised text for Opinion 1: Opinion 1: Promoting Internet Exchange Points (IXPs) as a long term solution to advance connectivity The RIRs support the position that Internet Exchange Points provide a long term solution to advancing connectivity and note the development of the existing IXP community via a bottom-up, multi-stakeholder process. Several independent, collaborative studies have demonstrated the efficiency of IXPs in furthering this aim and reducing the cost of Internet access for all. We support and recognise the success of, the existing efforts of associations that promote best practices amongst IXPs. These include Af-IX, APIX, Euro-IX and LAC-IX, specifically as they also serve to support new entrants into IXP markets. We also note the inherently multi-stakeholder approach that the Opinion invites Sector and State Members to adopt. These cases effectively illustrates the shared responsibilities of stakeholder groups in facilitating infrastructural developments that has successfully advanced Internet growth, improve quality and stability. Since IXPs play a critical role in promoting the efficient interconnection of ISPs through peering arrangements, the RIRs, in coordination with other Internet organisations, are also strong supporters of existing community and industry processes that promote and facilitate these arrangements. In particular, these include global and regional peering forums, including the recently launched African Peering Forum (AfPIF), the Middle East Peering Forum (MPF) and the long standing APRICOT (Asia Pacific) Peering Forum meetings, Network Access Points Forum from Latin America (NAPLA) and NANOG (North America) Peering Track. This needs to be approved by the RIR's and Paul will coordinate this. And we will continue to work with Jane on ISOCs position. Kind regards, Bijal Sanghani Head of Secretariat Euro-IX On 25 Apr 2013, at 16:14, Paul Rendek wrote: > Hello All, > > Thanks very much for your comments. I can see your point and I ahve had some discussions with Bijal (Euro-IX) who said she would work on some text that we can use to address your concerns. > > This text I think should be coordinated together with ISOC if they plan to provide a more detailed submission to Opinion 1. > > I await your text suggestion, but please be aware that time is now not on our side and I will need to have all five RIRs agree this text. > > If I cannot get text that suits in time we might have to consider removing any submission from the RIRs to Opinion 1. This may be better than a contribution that is not suitable for our community. > > Cheers, > Paul > > > > > On 4/24/13 1:10 PM, Bastiaan Goslings wrote: >> I agree as well - I stated simular worries earlier towards the Dutch delegation re draft opinion #1 >> >> -Bastiaan >> >> Skickat fr?n min iPad >> >> On Apr 24, 2013, at 11:03, Martin Boyle wrote: >> >>> +1 >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: cooperation-wg-bounces at ripe.net [mailto:cooperation-wg-bounces at ripe.net] On Behalf Of Lindqvist Kurt Erik >>> Sent: 24 April 2013 09:15 >>> To: Paul Rendek >>> Cc: cooperation-wg at ripe.net; Sally Wentworth >>> Subject: Re: [cooperation-wg] [ncc-announce] [news] RIRs Publish Response to ITU WTPF Opinions on Internet Governance >>> >>> >>> On 23 apr 2013, at 16:40, Paul Rendek wrote: >>> >>>> Thanks very much for your suggestion. While we will submit the text, we plan to speak further to it during the WTPF and will highlight the role of regional peering groups. >>>> >>>> There is a reason that we did not provide a more detailed response to Opinion 1. An initial response on this opinion was given by ISOC and I believe they intend to submit a more thorough response to this particular opinion. I suggest you speak further with ISOC regarding their planned text submission on Opinion 1. >>>> >>>> Please contact Sally Wentworth @ ISOC about this. She can be reached at and I have CC'd her in this message. >>>> >>>> I look forward to seeing you in Dublin. >>> I think the NRO text is troubling. It talks about multistakerholderism but it fails to invite, or as I would prefer recommend (not to say demand) that the ITU work and support inside existing frameworks rather than create competing efforts. I think it's important that this is clearly spelled out and not just talked over or mentioned. If the NRO isn't changing this statement (that I think is far from clear) then I really hope that ISOC includes this and stresses the importance of the ITU not working against or outside established and well working efforts. >>> >>> Best regards, >>> >>> - kurtis - >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: