[address-policy-wg] RIPE staff vs Court

On Oct 21, 2009, at 8:21 PM, Max Tulyev wrote:

> Hello Mark,
>
> I'm not against RIPE decision now, I'm against drop down ten  
> businesses
> down just because one man thought that "it seems" something for him.
>
> Each such business-critical case should be pedantic investigated by a
> group of authoritative people, if not a court. No way any "it  
> seems..."!
>
> While Dutch Court process a case (it is not a hours or days, much  
> more I
> think) clients will went away, isn't it?


Well depends, let's assume you find yourself a lawyer and go to court:

- judge points you back to arbitration in 5 minutes
- judge decides other wise:
	- reclaims the addresses
		This simply creates the big and feared red button all those film and  
record companies are hoping for, any case of 				copyright infringment  
within the RIPE region has a real good chance of ending up in Dutch  
court to reclaim the IPs.
		Wether this actually will stop routing is not important, it's  
because they can.
	- he dedcides you can keep the addresses.
		Oh great, if a request is turned down by a hostmaster I can now go  
to court and fight over that last /8.

Now there is a fair chance that both decissions are appealed for and  
then again and again, which will take years and years and wil bring  
significant cost to the NCC, which in the end has to be paid by the  
members, that's you, me and approx 6000 others. It will be a strange  
situation that while you fight them, technically you pay the lawyers  
on both sides :)

In the meantime what that judge in his internal wisdom has done, is  
proclaim himself to boss of the internet, IANA can go and further  
assigments are done by the joined Dutch judges in which case I think  
the Dutch government has someting to explain to the rest of the world.

And yes I have been in court cases about IP addresses and yes you can  
forget about a judge actually understanding the mechanisms at work and  
make a sensible judgement inline with what was internationally agreed  
on.

Taking this to court will make everybody cry, one way or another there  
is a fair chance we will end with nothing but loosers and a huge bill  
to pay.

I can understand you are pissed off, I would be too if I recieved such  
a letter. Let it cool down for a bit, count to ten and tomorrow try  
and contact a hostmaster or IPRA as they are called these days to  
explain what happened here and see if you can work out how to correct  
this following the regular processes. If this fails please try  
arbitration first before going to court, the procedure is there and is  
very clear and you save the community from a hell of a headache and  
the membership from a huge bill.

MarcoH