[members-discuss] Surprise on renew fees

Well, if the new 2012 charging scheme was processed, then it will be based
on amount of resource we are using.

Otherwise, as new comer(we too.), we pay more than old ones. it does make
for new start-up more difficult in some ways, and protected the old ones.
as the argument that the time the Lir have got the IP address which then it
was "cheaper", doesn't really stand on it's ground, because today, the new
IP and old IP has same value. For example, if you have 1Million dollar by
1990, if you kept till today at home, you still spend the money as it is
today's 1 million dollar, but not the real money converted to today's
value(which will be way more than 1M due to inflation).

The same goes for IP, if IP's price goes up, it not only benefits the new
comer who got the IP but also the old ones who already had the IP. If
everybody is holding something has same value, why one party should be
paying more while another should be paying less.

I had a discussion with one of Ripe people, we also both think that Ripe
might should be charging member based on amount of IP they are using(which
is "real fair"), but they cannot do it. I don't know if everybody realize
this:  Most large company spend less on their millions IP than their
coffees(Think of that, in per IP costs term, the one in extra large are
paying 5500 Euro for about 10 million IPs, which means 0.00000055
Euro/Ip/year for them, while for small ones around 50 cents/ip/year, which
is almost 1 million times more expensive than what the large ones paying).
So the solution might be raise the "large" member's fee and lower small
member's fee, which was exactly what charging scheme was trying to do. My
personal opinion on the new charging scheme, it just was not raise enough
for the extra large ones. otherwise it will get pass:)

But on the other side of the story, I mean the current fees are only
few thousands euro a year, it is less costs then anything else in your
business, your server, you data center, your peering, it is almost the
cheapest thing in this business,  I do think ripe is very efficiency
organization based on what amount of resource it's managing.  Even though I
do think it might not be very fair for most small ones and new comers, but
personally I complaint on something already happened might not be a very
good idea, it might be more worth to spend more than discuss the 2013's
charging scheme will looks like. See if we can get more fair this time:)

Lu

On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 11:35 AM, <poty at iiat.ru> wrote:

>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: members-discuss-bounces at ripe.net [mailto:members-discuss-
> > bounces at ripe.net] On Behalf Of Comunicaciones ACOTELSA
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2011 2:18 PM
> > To: members-discuss at ripe.net
> > Subject: Re: [members-discuss] Surprise on renew fees
> >
> ...
> >
> > And I don´t like speak about the general meetings to deal the new
> > charge scheme because in my enterprise, with only one /26 IPv4, we
> > can´t pay the cost to go to the general meeting (travel, salary) and I
> > and imagine that there are more like us so only the big enterprise can
> > assist, negotiate and vote (although we can use the internet vote).
> Yes! You knew this! Why you don't use your vote rights through the
> Internet then? It doesn't rise you expenses and you have had the full
> ability to vote for all questions since this year! Many LIRs got the
> opportunity at the last meeting. Our company can't (like yours) go to each
> general meeting, but I took every opportunity for 3 year already to vote
> electronically!
>
> >
> > In resume, I can't understand why a foundation increase its expenses
> > year over year.
> If you don't take part in the community discussions and don't vote -
> you'll never know why. You can read all about last GM and learn that for
> the coming year RIPE NCC will publish expenses in more details. You can
> suggest to eliminate an activity to lower the overall cost and if you have
> support - the increases may stop!
>
> Regards,
> Vladislav Potapov
> Ru.iiat
>
>
> ----
> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the
> general page:
> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>
> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From
> here, you can add or remove addresses.
>



-- 
--
Kind regards.
Lu

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