RIPE NCC Contributors
Committee September 23rd 1997 Meeting |
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Minutes
Scribe: Paula Caslav
Document: ripe-169
ABSTRACT
Traditionally these minutes reflect the detailed discussions
for the benefit of those unable to attend the meeting.
Those interested in a very short summary may want to
refer to the Appendix listing the decisions.
List of Participants (incomplete):
Name
Lajos Balint: HUNGARNET
Jaroslav Bobovsky: SANET
Antonio-Blasco Bonito: CNR
Andrea Colangelo: Flashnet S.p.A.
Bridget P. Cosgrave: ETSI
Klaus Ellegaard: Azlan Scandinavia A/S
Alexandre Fasani: GRAPHNET Inc.
Gordon Fielden: FireNet Limited
Michael Froehlich: Ebone NOC
Roberto Gaetano: ETSI
Hans Petter Holen: Scandinavia Online AS
Dana Hudes: Graphnet
Daniel Karrenberg: RIPE NCC
Kurt Kayser: VIAG Interkom
Dragan Kovacevic: Telekom Srbija
Mirjam Kuehne: RIPE NCC
Siegfried Langenbach: CSL
Klaus Landefeld: Nacamar
Maarten E. Linthorst: GoldNet / CSI Communication Systems Inc. AG
Erik Lohr: IBM
Thierry Louail: COLT
Ruben Martinez: RedIRIS
Balazs Martos: CSL GmbH
Kees Neggers: SURFnet
Carol Orange: RIPE NCC
Juergen Rauschenbach: DFN-Verein e.V.
Paul Ridley: RIPE NCC
Marc Roger: BELNET
Carsten Schiefner: TCP/IP GmbH
Gordana Dubajic Sekulic: "Telekom Srbija"
Igor Semenyuk: Sovam Teleport
Nick Shield: UKERNA
Cliff Stanford: Demon Internet Limited
Henk Steenman: AT&T VAS
Nigel Titley: British Telecom
Michele Trotta: Flashnet S.p.A.
Mourad Veeneman: A2000 / Kabeltelevisie Amsterdam
Aude Vergult: TRANSPAC
Karel Vietsch: TERENA
Wim Vink: EUnet
Ton Windgassen: IBM Global Services Network Services
Wilfried Woeber: VUCC - ACOnet
Zoltan Zsido: Westel 900 GSM Mobile Teleco.
List of Apologies (incomplete):
Peter Villemoes: NORDUNET
0. Welcome and Preliminaries:
Kees Neggers welcomed all attendees. He volunteered to chair the
meeting, everybody agreed. The agenda was agreed.
1. RIPE NCC Activity Report: (ripe-144)
Mirjam Kuehne and Carol Orange (RIPE NCC) reported.
Document:
http://www.ripe.net/docs/ripe-144.html
ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/docs/ripe-144.txt
ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/docs/ripe-144.ps
Slides: http://www.ripe.net/meetings/ripe/ripe-28/pres/act-rep/
Registration Services Summary: Number of registries growing linearly
(1 new LIR per day), therefore the amount of work is still
growing. Registration Services addressed this growth with better
internal organisation (deputy manager, better registry handler system,
better internal documentation), increased automation (reverse
delegation is now fully automated, ticketing system has been
improved), and hiring more staff. The RIPE NCC is focusing on
internal and external quality. During the last year the RIPE NCC did a
lot of liaison work, specially related with the set up of the new
Regional Internet Registry for the Americas ARIN and the possible new
structure of the IANA.
Administration Activities Summary: The administrative department was
specially concerned with preparations for the RIPE NCC association.
Much of the administrative work that was previously done at TERENA is
now being moved to the RIPE NCC.
Coordination Activities Summary: Database activity has been growing
steadily and rapidly. The engineering department is concentrating on
keeping the database stable and providing better documentation for
users. The department is planning on working on Routing Registry
notification/authorisation implementation, a database consistency
project, working with the database security task force and RPSL
developments. The department is also continuing work on the Test
Traffic Measurement project.
Discussion:
Growth:
Kees Neggers (SURFnet) asked how the RIPE NCC will
deal with the growth. Carol Orange answered that there are structural
changes to deal with staff growth. For the database growth, the RIPE
NCC is looking at the software and will restructure it to deal with
growth (present software wasn't originally built for this kind of
growth).
Kees Neggers asked whether the changes can it be done in time for the
growth without causing problems. Carol Orange replied that the RIPE
NCC is currently coping with the growth and have a realistic plan to
continue doing so. For the database re-engineering the RIPE NCC plans
to work with consultants to do it more quickly rather than waiting to
hire and train new staff.
2. RIPE NCC Activity Plan & Expenditure 1998
Document:
http://www.ripe.net/docs/ripe-162.html
ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/docs/ripe-162.txt
ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/docs/ripe-162.ps
Slides: http://www.ripe.net/meetings/ripe/ripe-28/pres/coco-act/
Summary:
Daniel Karrenberg gave a short overview of the document highlighting
the changes from this year's activities, and the budget for 1998. The
NCC expects a growth of 40% in the number of registries for 1998. The
RIPE NCC is planning to increase focus on reliability and quality.
Discussion:
Internal Quality Control:
Dana Hudes (Graphnet) asked how the RIPE NCC will measure the
improvement of quality? What are the service goals that are targeted?
Daniel Karrenberg replied that the measures are being developed at the
moment. This is a very difficult thing to do because if you chose the
wrong measures, like response time, quality actually goes down. The
RIPE NCC has a process in place to develop measures that are useful-
is a request being evaluated properly? what's the level of complaints?
etc.. The measures that they'll choose have to be more deep than just
response time.
Paul Ridley added that the RIPE NCC will use European Foundation for
Quality Management Guidelines for Public Sector Model, which focuses
on non-profit organisations. They are just starting on this activity,
and have started looking at critical success factors and what are the
processes that achieve them. The RIPE NCC will publish the results
once they're finished. They'll publish the measurements and the
results.
Growth:
Wim Vink (EUnet) asked how the RIPE NCC will cope with the growth,
will they have smaller groups internally? Also why such a large growth
in administrative department? Daniel Karrenberg answered that the
general structure the RIPE NCC has established is sound and can cope
with the expected growth. They will refine those structures as
necessary. In registration services there is now a deputy manager, in
engineering there are smaller groups working on individual projects,
however the overall line management will remain same.
As for the growth in the administrative department: It is understaffed
at the moment, the RIPE NCC is taking over functions that have
hitherto been done by TERENA. There are also new activities- Paul
Ridley will do more content work such as participating in the TLD WG's
activities. The RIPE NCC will shortly hire an office manager who will
take over day-to day office work from Paul. They also plan to have a
training person, who will be responsible for all the organisational
aspects of the training courses. In general the NCC is moving the day
to day routine work away from the highly paid, qualified people.
Database Growth:
Igor Semenyuk (Sovam Teleport) commented that the current database
growth rate might be a problem soon and asked whether the RIPE NCC is
considering distributing the database structure- geographically for
example? Daniel Karrenberg replied that both the NCC and the RIPE Database WG
have considered and rejected this option for the time being. The
database has a notary function for address space allocations and
assignments; we have to be sure of the state at any given point in
time and have to be able to query it. If it is distributed there are
problems with authority, consistency & availability. That is why we
have one central db which is duplicated at numerous points for
redundancy.
IPV6 Activities:
Juergen Rauschenbach (DFN) asked whether the RIPE NCC is expecting
large growth in IPv6 work in registration services or in the
database. Daniel Karrenberg replied that the RIPE NCC has been
following the developments for years now. There are two main
questions: What are the addressing models that will be accepted?
There has been lots of discussion in IETF on this but no real answer
to this question. And when will the European ISPs start to provide
-pilot- services in this area? The RIPE NCC will start with Ipv6
address space registration services as soon as required by the
European ISPs.
Euro ISPA
Bridget Cosgrave (ETSI) asked what impact will the creation of the
Euro ISPA have on RIPE NCC? Daniel Karrenberg answered that as far as
he knew, the Euro ISPA is an European ISP Association that is
currently being formed on the initiative of some ISPs and the European
Commission. If their activities are anything like the ISPA model from
the UK it seems to be mainly a lobbying organization; therefore its
activities are different from RIPE & the RIPE NCC. At the last
meeting it was decided that the RIPE NCC will not engage in lobbying
activities because the contributors are concerned that this would
endanger the NCC's neutrality and impartiality.
Last Year's Budget:
Lajos Balint (HUNGARNET) asked whether the budget as agreed upon at
the last contributors committee meeting still the expenditure for this
year. Daniel Karrenberg answered that last year's initial planning was
correct. At the beginning of the year the RIPE NCC expected that they
would need more money for an increased level of activities. At present
they expect that the expenditure will be very close to the amounts
that were budgeted originally, e.g. a total of 1984 kECU.
Collection of Debts:
Wim Vink asked whether the collection of debts has improved? Paul
Ridley replied that collection has improved, the RIPE NCC has taken
the last 2 months to focus on credit management; there was 50,000 ECU
in debts from earlier years that were formally written off earlier
this year, however the RIPE NCC still follows up on them and stop
service if they do not pay.
Dana Hudes asked whether if the registry still do not pay the NCC
takes address space away? Daniel Karrenberg answered that address
space is not leased, address space assignments are valid as long as
the original reason for an assignment is still valid. The RIPE NCC
does not reclaim address space from end users unless there is a reason
to believe that the original criteria for the assignment are no longer
valid. You pay for registration services, if you stop paying you get
no more services, but the NCC does not take away assigned address
space. Starting to do that would would need a global policy change.
Mirjam Kuehne added that if the RIPE NCC closes a registry for
whatever reason, they take back the unused part of the current
allocation, i.e. the addresses not yet handed out to end users. But
any assigned address space remains assigned.
Wilfried Woeber (ACONET) asked whether the RIPE NCC makes an
allocation to a new registry before the money has shown up on the bank
account? Daniel Karrenberg answered that the RIPE NCC follows the
general business practice of assuming that the other party will honour
written commitments. Therefore the NCC requires a signed service
assignment which constitutes an obligation to pay the service fee.
They then start services. The NCC can do that because they mainly deal
with companies and not individuals, so usually the NCC can collect the
debts. There is a registry set-up procedure that's documented on the
web.
3. RIPE NCC Charging Scheme for 1998 Presentation (ripe-163)
Paul Ridley
Document:
http://www.ripe.net/docs/ripe-163.html
ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/docs/ripe-163.txt
ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/docs/ripe-163.ps
Slides: http://www.ripe.net/meetings/ripe/ripe-28/pres/chg1998/
Daniel Karrenberg summarises: The NCC proposes a 74% increase in
expenditure for 1998 over 1997. This budget increase is mainly due to
more activities being done and to the introduction of quality
management. The number of contributors is expected to grow by only
40% Hence the NCC will have to raise the fees. They propose to use the
1997 charging model raising the sign-up fee back to the level of 1996
because costs for new registries have increased. They also propose to
raise the yearly fees roughly equally in all categories. Should the
growth of customers be different from the expected, the expenditures
will be adjusted accordingly.
The yearly fees will be as shown (earlier years for comparison):
+-----------------------------------+
| Charge 1998 1997 1996 |
+-----------------------------------+
| Yearly SMALL 2450 2200 1500 |
|Yearly MEDIUM 3400 3000 4500 |
| Yearly LARGE 4500 4000 8500 |
| |
| Sign-Up 2000 1300 2000 |
+-----------------------------------+
Enterprises pay the same fee as a "Small" registry and Supernationals
pay n times the "Large" fee.
During 1998 the usefulness of these special categories
shall be investigated.
Discussion:
There was no discussion. Wim Vink commented that the fact that there
has been no discussion is a confirmation of the result of last year's
work and thorough discussions. The RIPE NCC did good job of balancing
the various interests & implementing the charging scheme according to
last year's discussion.
Decision:
Both the activity plan (ripe-162) and the charging model (ripe-163)
for 1998 are formally agreed without amendments.
Discussion of Executive Board Election Procedure
At this point there was a short discussion about the
election of the executive board later on the agenda:
Hans Petter Holen (Scandinavia Online) said that some of the
candidates are not here today but have offered to present themselves;
should we contact them and ask them to come? Paul Ridley explained
that the fact that they are not here has no influence, as they will
not be asked to speak about themselves. Kees Neggers added that you
can be a candidate without having to be here to present yourself,
everybody had ample time to present themselves in e-mail.
Dana Hudes asked, if candidates have not come to this meeting, how can
you guarantee that they will come to other meetings. Paul Ridley
explained that this meeting is only open to contributors, however the
Executive Board is open to non-contributors. Therefore there are some
nominees that were not invited to attend this meeting. If they are
elected, they will be able to come to all such meetings in the future.
Klaus Landefeld (NACAMAR) asked whether people who are not
contributors should be on the board at all? Juergen Rauschenbach asked
for an explanation of what the advantage is of having non-contributors
on the EB?
Kees Neggers said that there will be a presentation of the new
structure and if it is agreed upon we will enter into the election &
discussion of the procedures. These questions will be answered and
discussed later.
4. Report of the "New Structure" Preparations Group (ripe-161)
Karel Vietsch (TERENA) presented.
Wim Vink, Paul Ridley & Karel Vietsch formed a committee last year to
decide on the structure of the new RIPE NCC after it separates from
TERENA.
Document:
http://www.ripe.net/docs/ripe-161.html
ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/docs/ripe-161.txt
ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/docs/ripe-161.ps
Slides: http://www.ripe.net/meetings/ripe/ripe-28/pres/de-facto/
Summary:
The RIPE NCC will be incorporated as an association and take over the
RIPE NCC activities on January 1st 1998.
Karel presented the progress in the separation of the RIPE NCC and
TERENA. The new association will have a General Assembly (GA) of all
the contributors, and an Executive Board (EB) of 3-5 elected "natural
persons". For the first two years, a TERENA appointed representative
will serve on the EB and will have veto power the first year, because
if the RIPE NCC association goes bankrupt, TERENA could still be held
liable for the first year. There will also have a Treasury Committee
that will audit the NCC's financial accounts.
Discussion:
Dutch Tax Laws:
Dana Hudes asked why are Dutch laws giving the NCC a problem, can't
they pick any other European country and set up the official
organisation there? Karel Vietsch explained that the Dutch tax laws
are not giving the NCC a problem, this will be explained in a later
presentation.
TERENA member on Executive Board:
Cliff Stanford (Demon) asked why TERENA gets a seat on the Executive
Board. Karel Vietsch explained that there will be liability for TERENA
even after the separation, if the new organization goes bankrupt
within the first year, TERENA can go bankrupt as well. TERENA will
have one member for two years, and will have veto rights for any
decisions that will affect TERENA for one year.
Wim Vink commented that it should be specified what TERENA can and
can't do. Karel Vietsch explained that it will only apply to decisions
that could lead to financial consequences for TERENA. Wim Vink
commented that the activity plan has been agreed upon therefore there
should not be any expenditures that will cause problem for
TERENA. Karel Vietsch explained that there could be things that come
up that are not in the activity plan, for example moving to new
office. Decisions have to be made about things not in activity plan.
Wilfried Woeber added that there is also a requirement that any
execution of the veto has to be publically documented and will be
known to the General Assembly with reason why. Daniel Karrenberg
explained that limiting the veto right formally was discussed with
legal advisors; they advised that it is difficult if not impossible to
circumscribe a qualified veto right. There could be endless conflict
about it. Therefore the intention of the veto right is formally
documented and a public justification is required when using it. If
the veto is used, the public will know about it. That is the best
protection.
Cliff Stanford asked whether the General Assembly will have the right
to remove the TERENA member. Karel Vietsch answered that they will,
but TERENA will be able to replace the person
Gordon Fielden asked whether if there's a decision made and TERENA
vetoes it, the General Assembly will have right to overturn it. Karel
Vietsch answered that the veto only exists to protect TERENA from
liabilities, if the General Assembly would decide to do something
extreme that would cause TERENA to go bankrupt, TERENA would still
want to veto it without being overturned.
Lajos Balint commented that this discussion is purely academic, the
General Assembly can remove the part about having a TERENA member on
the Executive Board.
Hans Petter Holen commented that TERENA to achieve a certain goal is
using the wrong mechanism, what TERENA should do is make a formal
agreement with the new organization to ensure its financial
security. Karel Vietsch answered that he would welcome alternative
proposals. What Hans Petter Holen is proposing is no protection at
all. If this organization goes bankrupt, TERENA will have no recourse
but some debtors like the employees may hold TERENA liable.
Kees Neggers explained that one of the first things the new
organisation will do is sign a contract with TERENA. But during the
time that TERENA really has liabilities, TERENA needs some
involvement. The only thing TERENA wants is a good, powerful RIPE
NCC, they want to have a healthy future.
Kurt Kaiser asked, whether, since it is a split, and there's a Dutch
law about liability, would RIPE NCC be liable for TERENA if TERENA
goes bankrupt? Karel Vietsch answered that no, liability is only from
the TERENA side because TERENA is the existing organization, RIPE NCC
is the new organisation that is splitting off.
RNA membership at the beginning of setup:
Igor Semenyuk asked about the fact that the RNA will have zero members
on day 1. Can a legal organisation can't exist without members? Karel
Vietsch answered that at some point somebody will go to notary
formally establish the association at that point the association will
have zero members, but after it's officially set up, the present
contributors can start signing contracts and become official
members. Paul Ridley added that you can have an open organization,
decisions that cannot be made without the General Assembly but
decisions made by Executive Board can be made because the Executive
Board will be in place from the beginning.
Igor Semenyuk asked whether the contributors can elect an Executive
Board now without being members of the RNA? Paul Ridley explained that
legally, that's not a problem.
Need for a quorum:
Klaus Landefeld asked whether there is any legal aspect in Dutch law
about needing a quorum to vote in a General Assembly?
Karel Vietsch answered that there is not. So it is completely up to us
what we write into the laws of the new organization.
Klaus Landefeld asked of the contributors what they want to decide on
this. Kees Neggers commented that if you look at today's meeting,
which is more important than previous meetings, there is only a small
percentage present (less than 5 %). This is not likely to improve in
the future. Karel Vietsch commented that if you have good discussion
on the mailing lists and reach consensus electronically, it does not
matter how many people show up at the meetings. In principle there is
nothing wrong with having entirely electronic discussions.
Cliff Stanford asked whether proxy voting will be allowed at the
meeting. Karel Vietsch answered that this is not mentioned in in the
proposal explicitly; It is open to discussion
Appeals procedure:
Gordon Fielden asked whether there is an appeals procedure. Daniel
Karrenberg answered that the Executive Board should not be the appeals
board, there could be conflicts of interest. What the Executive Board
should do is put the right procedures in place. Two months ago he
circulated a proposal to start discussion on this. The proposal is for
the General Assembly to decide on the appeal procces. One might have a
pool of arbitrators approved by the General Assembly, when there is a
conflict, each party would choose an arbiter from the pool and the two
arbiters would choose a third. He has only got 2 private reactions to
the e-mail, there was no public discussion.
Dana Hudes commented that the proposed structure is great idea, this
is a structure that has been tried and has worked in the past. This
idea is thousands of years old and it works.
Gordon Fielden commented that there needs to be an appeals process
from the beginning, not set it up later. Daniel Karrenberg answered
that the NCC as been operating for 5 years and nobody has taken them
to court, that is the appeals process now. All the conflicts they've
had could be resolved. He agrees that it is an important matter, but
it is not a prerequisite for proceeding. There was not much response
to his earlier proposal.
Kees Neggers commented that the appeals procedure today is to go to
TERENA. That has not happened so far. The appeals power should be in a
formal procedure. If the contributors elect an Executive Board today,
they should do two things: Set up the new organisation and set up an
appeals procedure. Paul Ridley answered that the first proper General
Assembly meeting could approve or amend any procedures that are put
in place before that time by the Executive Board.
Kees Neggers added that when we start the association and everybody
signs a contract there needs to be an appeals process already in
place. By signing the agreement, the contributors are agreeing to the
appeals procedure.
Dana Hudes commented that in the US they are starting to see ISPs that
start litigation if they do not get their way. The appeals process
should be mandatory and part of service agreement. Kees Neggers agreed
and said that that's why the process needs to be defined quickly.
4 b. Financial Separation of TERENA & RNA (ripe-164)
Presentation: Paul Ridley
Document:
http://www.ripe.net/docs/ripe-164.html
ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/docs/ripe-164.txt
ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/docs/ripe-164.ps
Slides: http://www.ripe.net/meetings/ripe/ripe-28/pres/fin-sep/
4c. Paul Ridley presentation: RNA tax position (ripe-165)
Presentation: Paul Ridley
Document:
http://www.ripe.net/docs/ripe-165.html
ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/docs/ripe-165.txt
ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/docs/ripe-165.ps
Slides: http://www.ripe.net/meetings/ripe/ripe-28/pres/taxposition/
Summary: The two presentations covered the financial consequences for
the split and the tax agreements that have been arranged with the
Dutch tax authorities for the new RIPE NCC association. No taxes will
have to be paid for transferring the money from the TERENA bank
accounts to the RIPE NCC accounts. It has also been agreed that the
new RIPE NCC will not have to pay any company tax. The RIPE NCC will
also have a personnel fund to pay employees' salaries for an x number
of month in case of financial problems. The NCC will not pay any tax
on the personnel fund.
Discussion:
Personnel Fund:
Gordon Fielden asked why a personnel is fund necessary. Isn't there
some protection in the Dutch law to help employees if an organization
goes bankrupt? Paul Ridley explained that the court may say that a
person can get several months worth of salary, but if the company is
bankrupt, the employees still get nothing. The employees are not
necessary the first creditors.
Kees Neggers commented that it's necessary to have protection that if
the company is at risk, staff does not decide to go away and find
another job. This is to avoid people looking for another job because
they feel unsafe. Daniel Karrenberg added that the NCC is not in the
job of producing anything. The NCC's job security depends on Internet
governance, if it is decided that the work the NCC is doing should be
done another way, the NCC will have to stop its work, but there will
probably be a period of several months for the transition.
Gordon Fielden commented that there should be a limit to how far the
reserves can go. Paul Ridley replied that there is a limit. There is a
formula of x number of months salary for x number of employees; the x
months is open to negotiation. The Executive Board can discuss this
with the tax authorities.
General Comments:
Kees Neggers commented that the committee did a good job preparing the
new structure There was agreement among contributors on this. Kees
Neggers also added that the RIPE NCC also did a good job, we should
thank the management & staff for their work. There was also agreement
among contributors on this.
5. Decisions about setting up of RIPE NCC Association
Kees Neggers said that decisions about setting up a RIPE NCC
Association need to be made now. The proposal is to set it up
according to the structure described in ripe-161, any major proposals
for changes?
Gordon Fielden asked whether the contributors can decide on a
temporary appeals procedure before voting on the new structure.
Kees Neggers replied that the proposal is to agree on the setting up
the RNA, TERENA will do the legal work and the Executive Board will
work with TERENA to implement the structure, that Executive Board will
start working this afternoon. It is a substantial amount of work, so
if there are no amendments, does everyone agree that the RIPE NCC will
be incorporated according to structure?
Decision: The de-facto structure for the RIPE NCC Association is
agreed as proposed (ripe-161). TERENA is asked proceed with formal
incorporation of RNA based on this structure.
Decision: The RNA executive is asked to define conflict arbitration
procedure as soon as possible and before Jan 1st 1998.
Decision:
TERENA and the RNA executive committee are asked to implement a smooth
transition of RIPE NCC services from TERENA to RNA based on the
principles set down in the tax position document (ripe-165) and the
financial separation document (ripe-164).
6. Election of first RIPE NCC Executive Board members
Kees Neggers announced that there is a full consensus that the new
RIPE NCC Association will be structured as agreed. Anything not
implicitly said here at the meeting will be up to the Executive Board
to decide on, TERENA will only listen. TERENA has decided to choose
Kees Neggers to be the TERENA appointed member of the EB.
Four additional members need to be elected. Two will be elected for 3
year terms and two for 1 year terms. Kees Neggers' mandate is for a
two year term. Everybody agrees to the voting proposal?
There was general agreement.
Election itself: Proposal is to elect the board members 1 by one,
starting with members for 3 year term.
Comment:
Gordon Fielden commented that that EB members should only be
contributors.
Kees Neggers replied that the proposal now is that any person can be a
candidate, it is up to the voters to decide whether somebody is
qualified. If you make it mandatory that the person should be a
contributor that is a change to the procedure.
Daniel Karrenberg added that he strongly feels that it is better not
to limit eligibility to the EB. There will always be a number of
people who are widely respected and could make a good contribution to
the Executive Board even though they might not be working for a
contributor. at the time of the election. It's not a good thing to
exclude in the by-laws somebody from serving just because they are not
a contributor. General Assembly members should vote on the people
concerned and not on the principle.
Dana Hudes commented that there are outstanding members of the
community that could be on the Executive Board but it should be that
the contributors should have representation, there should be a limit
of how many seats can be filled by non contributors
Wilfried Woeber replied that the contributors should be aware that if
they want to have formal constraints that somebody should be a
contributor's employee then they will have to have a lengthy
process. What if the representative is no longer employed by a
contributor? Will the person have to resign? etc. The rules should
be flexible and efficient.
Klaus Landefeld added that usually board members should be named as
person, not as organization, but it is unusual for Executive Board
members not to be part of the association at all. Hans Petter Holen
replied that it is too late to change this now. However, if it is
decided that EB members have to work for a contributor, he would be
happy to formally employ the people who have been nominated.
Paul Ridley added that only members are allowed to vote, if the
majority of the members decide to vote for only contributors, they can
do that, but why exclude the option of having non-members if the
General Assembly decides to vote for them?
Siegfried Langenbach (CSL) asked for a clarification on which
non-contributors have been nominated. Kees Neggers answered that they
are Keith Mitchell & Frode Greisen.
Wim Vink suggested a vote on the subject.
Gordon Fielden proposed the amendment that only contributors be
eligible to the EB.
4 votes for, all others against. The motion is dismissed.
Dana Hudes proposed the amendment that at least 2 Executive Board
members out of 5 members are working for contributors.
2 votes for, 1 abstention, all others against. The motion is dismissed.
Nominees:
Antonio Blasco Bonito, IT CNR
Frode Greisen, DK EBONE
Klaus Landefeld, DE NACAMAR
Keith Mitchell, UK LINX
Cliff Stanford, UK DEMON
Martin Starnberger, LT TAIDE
Wim Vink NL EUNET,
Wilfried Woeber, AT ACONET
The elections were conducted as follows.
+---------------------------+
| First 3 Year Position |
+---------------------------+
|Antonio Blasco Bonito 1 |
|Klaus Landefeld 2 |
|Cliff Stanford 3 |
|Wilfried Woeber 4 |
|Frode Greisen 5 |
|Keith Mitchell 7 |
|Wim Vink 7 |
+---------------------------+
+--------------------+
| Run Off Round |
+--------------------+
|Wim Vink 10 |
|Keith Mitchell 17 |
+--------------------+
Keith Mitchell was elected for a three year term.
+-------------------------+
|Second 3 Year Position |
+-------------------------+
|Klaus Landefeld 2 |
|Cliff Stanford 3 |
|Wilfried Woeber 7 |
|Wim Vink 7 |
|Frode Greisen 8 |
+-------------------------+
Frode Greisen was elected for a three year term.
+---------------------------+
| First 1 Year Position |
+---------------------------+
|Antonio Blasco Bonito 3 |
|Klaus Landefeld 3 |
|Cliff Stanford 5 |
|Wim Vink 7 |
|Wilfried Woeber 9 |
+---------------------------+
Wilfried Woeber was elected for a one year term.
+---------------------------+
| Second 1 Year Position |
|Antonio Blasco Bonito 4 |
|Klaus Landefeld 6 |
|Cliff Stanford 7 |
|Wim Vink 10 |
+---------------------------+
Wim Vink was elected for a one year term.
All those elected accepted their election.
Closing
There being no further business the meeting was closed.
Appendix: Decisions of the Meeting
The RIPE NCC Activity Plan for 1998 (ripe-162 ) is approved without amendments.
RIPE NCC Charging Scheme for 1998 (ripe-163) is approved without amendments.
The de-facto structure for the RIPE NCC Association is
agreed as proposed (ripe-161). TERENA is asked proceed with formal
incorporation of RNA based on this structure.
without amendments.
The RNA executive board is asked to define conflict arbitration
procedure as soon as possible and before Jan 1st 1998.
TERENA and the RNA executive committee are asked to implement a smooth
transition of RIPE NCC services from TERENA to RNA based on the
principles set down in the tax position document (ripe-165) and the
financial separation document (ripe-164).
Executive board elections:
Keith Mitchell was elected for a three year term.
Frode Greisen was elected for a three year term.
Wilfried Woeber was elected for a one year term.
Wim Vink was elected for a one year term.
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